Latin America: Student dissent

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Latin America student dissent the topic for the eleven
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hundred and sixty eight consecutive broadcast of the Georgetown University radio
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forum. Another in a series of educational and informative programs from
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Washington D.C. The drudge town forum was founded in
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1946. This is Wallace Manning speaking to you by
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transcription from the Raymond Rice studio on the campus of Georgetown University.
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Historically as you would see to learning in the nation's capital today's discussion will be a
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Latin America student dissent participating are Dr.
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Thomas Dodd assistant professor of history at Georgetown University.
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Mr. fronts Yvonne Sauer a graduate student from Mexico currently
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a Ph.D. candidate in political science at Georgetown. Dr.
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Harold E. de those university professor of Latin American Studies School of
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International Service the American University and
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Armando Maan a graduate student from Argentina currently
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studying economics at the American University.
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Headlines in the news media have impressed on us the fact that
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serious student dissent exists in Europe and at home here in the United States
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but may not be as well-known is the fact that for 51 years
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there has been a Latin American student movement characterized by two generations of
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ferment a movement which is a curious amalgam of various
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voices. We ask today's guests to evaluate the history
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and present status of student dissent in Latin America with an emphasis on its
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unique features its main political thrust and its climate of intellectual
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elitism if time permits. Our panel may discuss how
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spontaneous The movement is and to what extent if at all it has been manipulated by forces
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outside the 21 Latin nations. I plan will attempt a
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comparison between student dissent in our country and its Latin American counterpart. And
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that's actually where we're going to begin asking Dr. Davis. Are there similarities
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comparisons that might be drawn between the students and in Latin America and here
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Mr. Fanning.
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I might respond to that question I think by referring to the
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manifesto that the students in Argentina issued some 51 years ago
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that in a sense began what we call this the student movement of rebellion in Latin
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America. And it suggests some very striking similarities I think to the way our students
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are thinking and responding and acting today. For example the
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statement with which they begin in 1918. We are
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treading over a revolution. We are living an American Power.
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And then it goes on until now all the universities have been the secure refuge of the mediocre
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the source of income for the ignorant and asylum for the feeble. A place for all the
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forms of tyranny and insensibility found a profession
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professorial chair to teach them. And then
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we want to root out from the authority from the university organism the archaic and barbarous
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concept of authority they go on to say. Youth does not know
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beg. It demands recognition of its right.
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I think this is just from the many striking similarities to those of us who have been
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listening to some of the dialogue going on today. Dr. Davis
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you have a comment on that.
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I use what's known as a faculty member. I see striking similarities
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of course in that manifesto but what interests me very much in reading a
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manifesto like this I see something that seems to have gone on and on through
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history the young attempting to control or at least to direct
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the contemporary society in which they live. Are we seeking to control it or
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to redirect it in their own interests and for their own objectives.
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But I think it's important to note is that the dissent in
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Latin America is I think considerable more intense or it has been over the
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years mainly because it is an area of the world which is developing which
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has reflected I think some very serious and grave. Disparity
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in society and so forth and therefore students are more sensitive to it
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and they I think through the years in Latin America have reflected in intensity as I've
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said the man for not just refer him in a university but
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also an attempt to redirect the society in rural
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beyond the university gates of the seat of learning.
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Thank you Dr. Dot I'm so I'm sorry. Let's let's hear from
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Mr. von SAR at this point who is from Mexico.
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Yes well I would like to continue on that Dr. dog's
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point. I think another area
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where you might consider is slight difference from the U.S. experience
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has been and the cultural and intellectual
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priority that the student has been given in Latin American society
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throughout there is to bring out the words you had in your introduction
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a sort of intellectual elitism that doesn't in my opinion exist yet
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for the student in this country. In other words to student Occupy is a has
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always occupied a very important position of very high and respected position in
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Latin American societies and I asked him you know going sorry if those that come from
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the fact that.
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He probably was ahead to begin with. I mean he was he comes from families
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who were able to to plan and execute his higher education
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and those on the lower strata are not are not likely to receive such an
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education.
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Well that's perfectly correct. In other words the student already
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automatically by the mere fact that he does enter a university has traditionally
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tended to belong to the upper crust of society.
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But precisely because Latin America has this great
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to have this vast Abizaid between the
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lower classes and the upper classes and the student in his
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leadership trying to reform society has tended to become sort of the
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bastion for democracy that is to say he
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represents the democratic aspirations of the people and translates
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them and expresses them in in the best manner.
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Dr. Davies I wonder if I couldn't just direct the question Mr. run slower here on this point
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because until last year. A good many of us who are
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interested in Latin America were saying that in Mexico all the student population had
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changed that it was no longer so characteristically an elite
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population that students were being drawn from the lower and middle sectors. But
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they were chiefly interested in their professional careers. So there was little likelihood of
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the university students of Mexico going out on one of these
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demonstration binges and then all of a sudden the lid blew off last
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fall. How do you explain it is the Mexican student body
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still as much an elite body as as the one in Argentina let's say.
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Or has it.
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There is a different well of course say yes to the situation of
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man out of Mexico I think is slightly different from many
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other countries in Latin America have a preset predominantly because of the fact that it has
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advanced so much in recent years. I think the major reason
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or one of the major reasons was precisely this question of autonomy that played a
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very important issue at the University of Mexico and has a
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Since the late one thousand twenty six placed a great emphasis almost a
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religious fervor on the question of university
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autonomy. There had been some dissent in the university
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between among student groups various student organizations as far
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as university administration is concerned and
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the unfortunate thing was that the guards at the
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police and the army went into the university and this became sort
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of the rallying point for the students to unite. In other words say the
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idea that foreign elements I'm saying foreign because they are not
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university elements that foreign elements of society like the military have
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stepped into the campus was an affront to university autonomy that
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helped consolidate the student movement I think it did.
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It was more this than any Mr. Mr.
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Manohar Argentinas been the repression heard from here it was from well
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there's two of us going from Argentina.
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I would like to say these are green
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these elite group was the one who
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composed most of the student population of the universities
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I think. One of the main reasons
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why the student body and the universities were so
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concerned in letting America with those issues
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those politically shows that were is so
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hard.
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Let's call them over there
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reflects precisely the fact that the student body
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doesn't belong to day two of the
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elite groups Dalit groups would tend to see them here in the United States
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as conservatives only guards as we tend to call them.
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And precisely the type of population that the
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university has is the reverse of these. They are mostly coming from the
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middle classes in their lower stratum so of the
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population. And this is
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precisely what makes the university students tick the
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fact that they want to change the situation by
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precisely fighting against this so called upper
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groups of the political ruling in the country. So
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today I think that this is a situation the population
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of the universities we showed in the group of people
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that want to fight against can be usually
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conservatives like in America Mr. Munn wouldn't you think though that this differs somewhat from one
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country to another.
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I think what you are describing perhaps would apply to Argentina. Would it apply
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equally to Peru let's say.
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Perhaps I think are old so
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let's call them democratic or you know they
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they have student body from all of this drought as a
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country also Colombia and quite a few new
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universities in Venezuela today are having
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students from all the stress.
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What if I make them a lot of time to read Dr Davis is a question that he
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just raised. Something comes into mind right away. So many
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students in Latin America work their not down they must go. And that
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perhaps they may be a trend in the direction where those who don't have to work will become the
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leaders of student movements I wonder if this might not be the case say in Mexico
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that those who don't have to be employed to sustain and
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keep their presence in a university might ultimately be the leaders of student
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movement something competitors. Yes I want to raise this again and I'm not so
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sure there's a leveling off everywhere and that is it. I just want to raise this
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point with you and see what how you respond to that.
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Well I think there is no thank you. I say that there is a yeah.
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Tendency in Latin America I think one of the seven plagues if you want to hear if
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Latin American student politics is the fact that you have a
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large number of professional students to contend with. In other words students that dedicate
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themselves to be longing professionalised and rising through
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naturally to high political positions through the
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university. I tend to agree with you that nowadays
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your recruitment in universities tends to come from a more representative
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base of society. However it's always been. And there have always
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been certain key faculties or key schools that have played an important role in
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student dissent. The law faculty for example is very important in that
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the medicine faculty would tend to be more conservative
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than the law faculty. The social science faculties tend to breed very
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much of this professional student who rises to high political positions later.
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Again Im supporting my statement of how intellectuals do tend to be respected.
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Is the fact that most national leaders
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in Mexico for example today I in fact I can't think of any top
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level leaders in either in the cabinet and the presidency who have not
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gone to the university.
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Who have not emerged from universities from the University student dissent
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movement often very often from the university to say it's so not you know
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we said at the beginning that this Latin American student movement
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is half a century old I think 51 years to be exact
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rendered it really start to show some some
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results. Has it over a long period of time or only
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since we've had similar student dissent movements
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across the world.
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I want to be on a diet yes ma'am and I started off in a way and it seems to me that
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the you know the Cordoba movement of 1918 well directed
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towards university reform that is structural reform may have reflected.
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The emerging middle class of the prominence of it in Argentine In that case but what is very
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striking and I think worth noting is that the Cordoba movement
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ignited or precipitated the development of a number of parties. And
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other countries have different different personalities Yast but I'm thinking of
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something while in Peru opera which certainly had some very wide
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ramifications besides of course university reform it reflected an indigenous
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movement in part. So many acts on democratic and Venezuela
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different shade different coloration there but I think the movement that Dr. Davis
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referred to at least his early quote there did develop into something far
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more significant than just simply university reform it really began to
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revolutionize party structure in other republics in Latin America don't you think so
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Dr. me up to that point from I mean I think that the president had to come
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at us certainly exactly to the point.
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But I think what I would go one step further and say that
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probably was more significant in the in its political
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influence than it was actually within the university that
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many of the things that the university reform was demanding they did not
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get but they did get one major thing which they have had to live with ever since in the
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university and this was a pattern of university organization in which
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faculty and students and frequently alumni have participated in
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constituting the governing board and this is one of the issues that our students today. I talking
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about a great deal. Who makes the decisions. They are asking and they're
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proposing a pattern of organization which in many ways is quite
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similar to what they the students proposed back here and they're in Latin
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America and what they got in the may well know
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is they are a success story there that we could pattern ourselves after as far as you're concerned.
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I'd rather turn that question to our Latin American students hey that's a very you
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know it was a mystery.
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It's already there were well within the
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university and I am again now only talking in terms of
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an institution that I'm more acquainted with at the University of Mexico.
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I mentioned previously the issue of autonomy which was one of the major
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political issues within the first of all let me interrupt you just and we're
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assuming that you had this in Mexico now along the lines discussed
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by doctors Darden Davis and it was what broke down in Mexico.
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Maybe if we understood that last at the end of last summer prior to the Olympic
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Games and so forth. What happened. What broke down there.
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Well I you know unfortunately was not
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present in Mexico during the entire problem. I was there
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only at its beginning stages. I do know from talking to
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Mexican students that the issue as it was initially
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presented became much greater. Yeah it became really a yet.
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Sure a force between the student body and then descend on the part of
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students primarily based upon the fact that it's softened like in most
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Latin American societies. You create a group of
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professionals that is to say you create lawyers architects
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engineers through the university system and you do not create at the same
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time institutions whereby these people might make a living
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later. Therefore you very often come up with a student population that is
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frustrated that doesn't see a great future
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for itself either because of the lack of top notch universities throughout the
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entire country where you can find a teaching positions or
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the overcrowding of the profession. Lack of technical
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schools in many countries. In Mexico this is not the case said there is a
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great emphasis on technological saying such as that of
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Monterrey and the police they can be going to Mexico City but. In
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Latin America in general there has been more of an emphasis on humanities
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on the professionals what we call here in the United States professional schools
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then the technological areas where people might
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work in society within society in a much more urgent
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way or in the areas that are much more urgently needed. Today in these developing
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countries what I was going to bring out in the case of Mexico is do you
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have the success story there as far as I can see has been also the development
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of opposition parties to what has predominantly tended to be a one
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party system. The two major opposition parties today grew out
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of student movements to a certain extent at least
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the leaders of both parties were major figures in the
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university in the Socialist Party. But about all of that no. And
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the conservative and National Action Party have
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a remotely or by the name of Comus Martine and the other
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success story politically within the university itself has been the
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success of the autonomy question the fact that the university was able
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to keep its autonomy in the 1030 said despite our duty to do this
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work for all who didn't do this.
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The strike begin in Lee in a secondary school. Yes and what
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what was responsible for the fact that the that the police
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had to intervene at this point and in the center violating the
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autonomy.
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Well I think the the issue of the day this summer in Mexico I was slightly aggravated
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by the Olympics which were going to be held in that
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later on. And of course I don't think this
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example this case this summer was a failure of the question of autonomy it was merely
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perhaps an overreaction on the part of the government for fear that if the
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student dissent within the university the student problems and we've got
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to remember that most of the games were going to be held near the university or at the university.
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You had the original email of a You administration worried about the
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fact that Mexico might not be able to keep up its commitments to the world. So I think this may be
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an explanation of why it overreacted I don't think it's a manifestation of
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that a failure on the part of the students on the autonomy question because
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Sort of us is very well aware of the president of Mexico off off
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the tee having him inviolability at the top. Autonomy question
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he can think was a student.
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Thank you Mr. Jones are now we may ask Mr. Maher. Does the
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university system in Argentina evolve
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from the quote above.
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Yes and yes you know and how would you measure it there for us as well
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as I've done to me has been very successful. You know Dana as
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far as meeting the students express themselves and
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promoting a political organization many times you know Argentina
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was one sided in the period from
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1946 until 1955. We had a one party
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system for a new system. It was the students
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the ones that I believe checked
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the bridges accessions you know the
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government did in Argentina
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the Tanami through say has been violated.
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Diamond time again not only no urgency no but just about every working life in America.
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What can we say about successfulness if successfulness means
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to be outdone in the US and to our big completely free or filed site
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influencers. Then we can say that their universities by
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enlarging like in America have not been successful because they have been
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interfered by the government time and time again in these cases
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had been when the.
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Governments were to one extreme or to the other
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to be you know didn't you know we do not have done I mean we have their
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government.
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We respect state constitution as far as certain
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liberties are concerned we have complete liberty of expressing ourselves.
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But the done to me of the university is
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not operating today. The professor sorry I signed by the
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government the minister and.
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Not they do not permit certain
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political factions to express themselves freely.
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If I could insert a very minute Mr Manning this is a change a
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lot of the present of the recent administration just a year or two ago wasn't it.
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Oregano changed a law and abolished a university autonomy essentially
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in July 18 in July of meaning 66.
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The things being things being what they are may I ask our two guests
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in the remaining two minutes.
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Things being what they are. Would you favor the system in this
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country or the system in Mexico and Argentina.
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You mean the system of autonomy. Or this city. Yeah
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if you wish to break it down.
[26:12 - 26:15]
Yes well in general terms.
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Well I do favor the concept of autonomy for Latin America
[26:19 - 26:25]
because it's basically a different issue I think and
[26:25 - 26:30]
this is one of the big differences between the Latin American and the US
[26:30 - 26:34]
student movements in their Latin America very often and I think
[26:34 - 26:40]
most of the time the university depends for its livelihood
[26:40 - 26:46]
on the government. And it
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it depends on on the government so much that you have a sort of a
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dichotomy. To a certain extent you need the funds and at the same time you
[26:56 - 27:01]
don't want to depend on the on the government for funds to where do you where do you get it.
[27:01 - 27:06]
I think in the case of the United States there is a more varied situation.
[27:06 - 27:12]
So what you're saying is it's a matter of apples and oranges for I'm right right right. And how do you feel about that
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Mr. Mann.
[27:13 - 27:18]
I feel quite the same way I think I'll Donnelly's something that shouldn't be.
[27:18 - 27:21]
We should have it in Latino America but I do not think it is
[27:21 - 27:28]
the nation that should be the main one in the United States.
[27:28 - 27:32]
University of movement. I do not think that the universities here
[27:32 - 27:38]
are oriented in the same way as our words are and I do not think
[27:38 - 27:43]
Don I mean one of the points that should be brought out
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by the student movement here in the United States.
[27:47 - 27:51]
Gentlemen thank you very much for your discussion of Latin America
[27:51 - 27:57]
and the United States I might add and student dissent. I thanks to Dr.
[27:57 - 28:02]
Thomas Dodd assistant professor of history at Georgetown University.
[28:02 - 28:06]
Mr. Francis funds are a graduate student from Mexico
[28:06 - 28:13]
currently a Ph.D. candidate in political science at Georgetown University.
[28:13 - 28:18]
To Dr. Harold E. Davis University professor of Latin American studies the School of
[28:18 - 28:22]
International Service the American University and Mr.
[28:22 - 28:27]
Armando. A graduate student from Argentina currently studying
[28:27 - 28:32]
economics at the American University. You have attended the weekly
[28:32 - 28:37]
discussion program the Georgetown University radio forum broadcast of which was
[28:37 - 28:41]
transcribed in the Raymond Rice studio on the campus of historic Georgetown
[28:41 - 28:46]
University in Washington D.C. next week you will hear discussed
[28:46 - 28:51]
the plight of Soviet Jewry. Our panel at that time will include
[28:51 - 28:56]
Dr. Isaac Frank executive vice president of the Jewish Community Council of Greater
[28:56 - 29:01]
Washington. And Mr. Leon Volkoff contributing editor for
[29:01 - 29:06]
East European affairs and Newsweek magazine. This
[29:06 - 29:11]
program has been presented in the interest of public education by Georgetown University.
[29:11 - 29:13]
Your moderator.
[29:13 - 29:17]
WALLACE banning this program was distributed by the national
[29:17 - 29:19]
educational radio network.