Latin America: Student dissent

Latin America student dissent the topic for the eleven

hundred and sixty eight consecutive broadcast of the Georgetown University radio

forum. Another in a series of educational and informative programs from

Washington D.C. The drudge town forum was founded in

1946. This is Wallace Manning speaking to you by

transcription from the Raymond Rice studio on the campus of Georgetown University.

Historically as you would see to learning in the nation's capital today's discussion will be a

Latin America student dissent participating are Dr.

Thomas Dodd assistant professor of history at Georgetown University.

Mr. fronts Yvonne Sauer a graduate student from Mexico currently

a Ph.D. candidate in political science at Georgetown. Dr.

Harold E. de those university professor of Latin American Studies School of

International Service the American University and

Armando Maan a graduate student from Argentina currently

studying economics at the American University.

Headlines in the news media have impressed on us the fact that

serious student dissent exists in Europe and at home here in the United States

but may not be as well-known is the fact that for 51 years

there has been a Latin American student movement characterized by two generations of

ferment a movement which is a curious amalgam of various

voices. We ask today's guests to evaluate the history

and present status of student dissent in Latin America with an emphasis on its

unique features its main political thrust and its climate of intellectual

elitism if time permits. Our panel may discuss how

spontaneous The movement is and to what extent if at all it has been manipulated by forces

outside the 21 Latin nations. I plan will attempt a

comparison between student dissent in our country and its Latin American counterpart. And

that's actually where we're going to begin asking Dr. Davis. Are there similarities

comparisons that might be drawn between the students and in Latin America and here

Mr. Fanning.

I might respond to that question I think by referring to the

manifesto that the students in Argentina issued some 51 years ago

that in a sense began what we call this the student movement of rebellion in Latin

America. And it suggests some very striking similarities I think to the way our students

are thinking and responding and acting today. For example the

statement with which they begin in 1918. We are

treading over a revolution. We are living an American Power.

And then it goes on until now all the universities have been the secure refuge of the mediocre

the source of income for the ignorant and asylum for the feeble. A place for all the

forms of tyranny and insensibility found a profession

professorial chair to teach them. And then

we want to root out from the authority from the university organism the archaic and barbarous

concept of authority they go on to say. Youth does not know

beg. It demands recognition of its right.

I think this is just from the many striking similarities to those of us who have been

listening to some of the dialogue going on today. Dr. Davis

you have a comment on that.

I use what's known as a faculty member. I see striking similarities

of course in that manifesto but what interests me very much in reading a

manifesto like this I see something that seems to have gone on and on through

history the young attempting to control or at least to direct

the contemporary society in which they live. Are we seeking to control it or

to redirect it in their own interests and for their own objectives.

But I think it's important to note is that the dissent in

Latin America is I think considerable more intense or it has been over the

years mainly because it is an area of the world which is developing which

has reflected I think some very serious and grave. Disparity

in society and so forth and therefore students are more sensitive to it

and they I think through the years in Latin America have reflected in intensity as I've

said the man for not just refer him in a university but

also an attempt to redirect the society in rural

beyond the university gates of the seat of learning.

Thank you Dr. Dot I'm so I'm sorry. Let's let's hear from

Mr. von SAR at this point who is from Mexico.

Yes well I would like to continue on that Dr. dog's

point. I think another area

where you might consider is slight difference from the U.S. experience

has been and the cultural and intellectual

priority that the student has been given in Latin American society

throughout there is to bring out the words you had in your introduction

a sort of intellectual elitism that doesn't in my opinion exist yet

for the student in this country. In other words to student Occupy is a has

always occupied a very important position of very high and respected position in

Latin American societies and I asked him you know going sorry if those that come from

the fact that.

He probably was ahead to begin with. I mean he was he comes from families

who were able to to plan and execute his higher education

and those on the lower strata are not are not likely to receive such an

education.

Well that's perfectly correct. In other words the student already

automatically by the mere fact that he does enter a university has traditionally

tended to belong to the upper crust of society.

But precisely because Latin America has this great

to have this vast Abizaid between the

lower classes and the upper classes and the student in his

leadership trying to reform society has tended to become sort of the

bastion for democracy that is to say he

represents the democratic aspirations of the people and translates

them and expresses them in in the best manner.

Dr. Davies I wonder if I couldn't just direct the question Mr. run slower here on this point

because until last year. A good many of us who are

interested in Latin America were saying that in Mexico all the student population had

changed that it was no longer so characteristically an elite

population that students were being drawn from the lower and middle sectors. But

they were chiefly interested in their professional careers. So there was little likelihood of

the university students of Mexico going out on one of these

demonstration binges and then all of a sudden the lid blew off last

fall. How do you explain it is the Mexican student body

still as much an elite body as as the one in Argentina let's say.

Or has it.

There is a different well of course say yes to the situation of

man out of Mexico I think is slightly different from many

other countries in Latin America have a preset predominantly because of the fact that it has

advanced so much in recent years. I think the major reason

or one of the major reasons was precisely this question of autonomy that played a

very important issue at the University of Mexico and has a

Since the late one thousand twenty six placed a great emphasis almost a

religious fervor on the question of university

autonomy. There had been some dissent in the university

between among student groups various student organizations as far

as university administration is concerned and

the unfortunate thing was that the guards at the

police and the army went into the university and this became sort

of the rallying point for the students to unite. In other words say the

idea that foreign elements I'm saying foreign because they are not

university elements that foreign elements of society like the military have

stepped into the campus was an affront to university autonomy that

helped consolidate the student movement I think it did.

It was more this than any Mr. Mr.

Manohar Argentinas been the repression heard from here it was from well

there's two of us going from Argentina.

I would like to say these are green

these elite group was the one who

composed most of the student population of the universities

I think. One of the main reasons

why the student body and the universities were so

concerned in letting America with those issues

those politically shows that were is so

hard.

Let's call them over there

reflects precisely the fact that the student body

doesn't belong to day two of the

elite groups Dalit groups would tend to see them here in the United States

as conservatives only guards as we tend to call them.

And precisely the type of population that the

university has is the reverse of these. They are mostly coming from the

middle classes in their lower stratum so of the

population. And this is

precisely what makes the university students tick the

fact that they want to change the situation by

precisely fighting against this so called upper

groups of the political ruling in the country. So

today I think that this is a situation the population

of the universities we showed in the group of people

that want to fight against can be usually

conservatives like in America Mr. Munn wouldn't you think though that this differs somewhat from one

country to another.

I think what you are describing perhaps would apply to Argentina. Would it apply

equally to Peru let's say.

Perhaps I think are old so

let's call them democratic or you know they

they have student body from all of this drought as a

country also Colombia and quite a few new

universities in Venezuela today are having

students from all the stress.

What if I make them a lot of time to read Dr Davis is a question that he

just raised. Something comes into mind right away. So many

students in Latin America work their not down they must go. And that

perhaps they may be a trend in the direction where those who don't have to work will become the

leaders of student movements I wonder if this might not be the case say in Mexico

that those who don't have to be employed to sustain and

keep their presence in a university might ultimately be the leaders of student

movement something competitors. Yes I want to raise this again and I'm not so

sure there's a leveling off everywhere and that is it. I just want to raise this

point with you and see what how you respond to that.

Well I think there is no thank you. I say that there is a yeah.

Tendency in Latin America I think one of the seven plagues if you want to hear if

Latin American student politics is the fact that you have a

large number of professional students to contend with. In other words students that dedicate

themselves to be longing professionalised and rising through

naturally to high political positions through the

university. I tend to agree with you that nowadays

your recruitment in universities tends to come from a more representative

base of society. However it's always been. And there have always

been certain key faculties or key schools that have played an important role in

student dissent. The law faculty for example is very important in that

the medicine faculty would tend to be more conservative

than the law faculty. The social science faculties tend to breed very

much of this professional student who rises to high political positions later.

Again Im supporting my statement of how intellectuals do tend to be respected.

Is the fact that most national leaders

in Mexico for example today I in fact I can't think of any top

level leaders in either in the cabinet and the presidency who have not

gone to the university.

Who have not emerged from universities from the University student dissent

movement often very often from the university to say it's so not you know

we said at the beginning that this Latin American student movement

is half a century old I think 51 years to be exact

rendered it really start to show some some

results. Has it over a long period of time or only

since we've had similar student dissent movements

across the world.

I want to be on a diet yes ma'am and I started off in a way and it seems to me that

the you know the Cordoba movement of 1918 well directed

towards university reform that is structural reform may have reflected.

The emerging middle class of the prominence of it in Argentine In that case but what is very

striking and I think worth noting is that the Cordoba movement

ignited or precipitated the development of a number of parties. And

other countries have different different personalities Yast but I'm thinking of

something while in Peru opera which certainly had some very wide

ramifications besides of course university reform it reflected an indigenous

movement in part. So many acts on democratic and Venezuela

different shade different coloration there but I think the movement that Dr. Davis

referred to at least his early quote there did develop into something far

more significant than just simply university reform it really began to

revolutionize party structure in other republics in Latin America don't you think so

Dr. me up to that point from I mean I think that the president had to come

at us certainly exactly to the point.

But I think what I would go one step further and say that

probably was more significant in the in its political

influence than it was actually within the university that

many of the things that the university reform was demanding they did not

get but they did get one major thing which they have had to live with ever since in the

university and this was a pattern of university organization in which

faculty and students and frequently alumni have participated in

constituting the governing board and this is one of the issues that our students today. I talking

about a great deal. Who makes the decisions. They are asking and they're

proposing a pattern of organization which in many ways is quite

similar to what they the students proposed back here and they're in Latin

America and what they got in the may well know

is they are a success story there that we could pattern ourselves after as far as you're concerned.

I'd rather turn that question to our Latin American students hey that's a very you

know it was a mystery.

It's already there were well within the

university and I am again now only talking in terms of

an institution that I'm more acquainted with at the University of Mexico.

I mentioned previously the issue of autonomy which was one of the major

political issues within the first of all let me interrupt you just and we're

assuming that you had this in Mexico now along the lines discussed

by doctors Darden Davis and it was what broke down in Mexico.

Maybe if we understood that last at the end of last summer prior to the Olympic

Games and so forth. What happened. What broke down there.

Well I you know unfortunately was not

present in Mexico during the entire problem. I was there

only at its beginning stages. I do know from talking to

Mexican students that the issue as it was initially

presented became much greater. Yeah it became really a yet.

Sure a force between the student body and then descend on the part of

students primarily based upon the fact that it's softened like in most

Latin American societies. You create a group of

professionals that is to say you create lawyers architects

engineers through the university system and you do not create at the same

time institutions whereby these people might make a living

later. Therefore you very often come up with a student population that is

frustrated that doesn't see a great future

for itself either because of the lack of top notch universities throughout the

entire country where you can find a teaching positions or

the overcrowding of the profession. Lack of technical

schools in many countries. In Mexico this is not the case said there is a

great emphasis on technological saying such as that of

Monterrey and the police they can be going to Mexico City but. In

Latin America in general there has been more of an emphasis on humanities

on the professionals what we call here in the United States professional schools

then the technological areas where people might

work in society within society in a much more urgent

way or in the areas that are much more urgently needed. Today in these developing

countries what I was going to bring out in the case of Mexico is do you

have the success story there as far as I can see has been also the development

of opposition parties to what has predominantly tended to be a one

party system. The two major opposition parties today grew out

of student movements to a certain extent at least

the leaders of both parties were major figures in the

university in the Socialist Party. But about all of that no. And

the conservative and National Action Party have

a remotely or by the name of Comus Martine and the other

success story politically within the university itself has been the

success of the autonomy question the fact that the university was able

to keep its autonomy in the 1030 said despite our duty to do this

work for all who didn't do this.

The strike begin in Lee in a secondary school. Yes and what

what was responsible for the fact that the that the police

had to intervene at this point and in the center violating the

autonomy.

Well I think the the issue of the day this summer in Mexico I was slightly aggravated

by the Olympics which were going to be held in that

later on. And of course I don't think this

example this case this summer was a failure of the question of autonomy it was merely

perhaps an overreaction on the part of the government for fear that if the

student dissent within the university the student problems and we've got

to remember that most of the games were going to be held near the university or at the university.

You had the original email of a You administration worried about the

fact that Mexico might not be able to keep up its commitments to the world. So I think this may be

an explanation of why it overreacted I don't think it's a manifestation of

that a failure on the part of the students on the autonomy question because

Sort of us is very well aware of the president of Mexico off off

the tee having him inviolability at the top. Autonomy question

he can think was a student.

Thank you Mr. Jones are now we may ask Mr. Maher. Does the

university system in Argentina evolve

from the quote above.

Yes and yes you know and how would you measure it there for us as well

as I've done to me has been very successful. You know Dana as

far as meeting the students express themselves and

promoting a political organization many times you know Argentina

was one sided in the period from

1946 until 1955. We had a one party

system for a new system. It was the students

the ones that I believe checked

the bridges accessions you know the

government did in Argentina

the Tanami through say has been violated.

Diamond time again not only no urgency no but just about every working life in America.

What can we say about successfulness if successfulness means

to be outdone in the US and to our big completely free or filed site

influencers. Then we can say that their universities by

enlarging like in America have not been successful because they have been

interfered by the government time and time again in these cases

had been when the.

Governments were to one extreme or to the other

to be you know didn't you know we do not have done I mean we have their

government.

We respect state constitution as far as certain

liberties are concerned we have complete liberty of expressing ourselves.

But the done to me of the university is

not operating today. The professor sorry I signed by the

government the minister and.

Not they do not permit certain

political factions to express themselves freely.

If I could insert a very minute Mr Manning this is a change a

lot of the present of the recent administration just a year or two ago wasn't it.

Oregano changed a law and abolished a university autonomy essentially

in July 18 in July of meaning 66.

The things being things being what they are may I ask our two guests

in the remaining two minutes.

Things being what they are. Would you favor the system in this

country or the system in Mexico and Argentina.

You mean the system of autonomy. Or this city. Yeah

if you wish to break it down.

Yes well in general terms.

Well I do favor the concept of autonomy for Latin America

because it's basically a different issue I think and

this is one of the big differences between the Latin American and the US

student movements in their Latin America very often and I think

most of the time the university depends for its livelihood

on the government. And it

it depends on on the government so much that you have a sort of a

dichotomy. To a certain extent you need the funds and at the same time you

don't want to depend on the on the government for funds to where do you where do you get it.

I think in the case of the United States there is a more varied situation.

So what you're saying is it's a matter of apples and oranges for I'm right right right. And how do you feel about that

Mr. Mann.

I feel quite the same way I think I'll Donnelly's something that shouldn't be.

We should have it in Latino America but I do not think it is

the nation that should be the main one in the United States.

University of movement. I do not think that the universities here

are oriented in the same way as our words are and I do not think

Don I mean one of the points that should be brought out

by the student movement here in the United States.

Gentlemen thank you very much for your discussion of Latin America

and the United States I might add and student dissent. I thanks to Dr.

Thomas Dodd assistant professor of history at Georgetown University.

Mr. Francis funds are a graduate student from Mexico

currently a Ph.D. candidate in political science at Georgetown University.

To Dr. Harold E. Davis University professor of Latin American studies the School of

International Service the American University and Mr.

Armando. A graduate student from Argentina currently studying

economics at the American University. You have attended the weekly

discussion program the Georgetown University radio forum broadcast of which was

transcribed in the Raymond Rice studio on the campus of historic Georgetown

University in Washington D.C. next week you will hear discussed

the plight of Soviet Jewry. Our panel at that time will include

Dr. Isaac Frank executive vice president of the Jewish Community Council of Greater

Washington. And Mr. Leon Volkoff contributing editor for

East European affairs and Newsweek magazine. This

program has been presented in the interest of public education by Georgetown University.

Your moderator.

WALLACE banning this program was distributed by the national

educational radio network.