Dr. Walter Judd, Part 2

It just is difficult but as simple as that. President Truman

came to it President Eisenhower came to President Kennedy came to it President Johnson has got to come

to it keep Red China on first base keep Red China on first base until this ending

of World History in somebody makes a mistake somebody somebody dies like

most of them or the situation changes worldwide or the internal

situation in China changes.

It is changing it will change people in first grade

because if you give them a second base then they want a third base.

What's third base. The rest of Asia Africa and Latin America.

That's not a mean nasty charge by me it's been proclaimed in the Lin Biao doctrine the

equivalent of Hitler's mind comp people didn't pay attention to that either. And that

doctrine says that the way to conquer the United States is not by attacking it.

They're not strong enough with inserting in. Organizing people's

wars in the rural areas and the North Atlantic is the equivalent of the

city. You see Western Europe and the United States. So after

second base these 15 peninsulas in which you live one pearl of all the

people in the world the rest the next is the rest of Asia Africa and Latin America.

They held a conference a little over a year two years ago now in January

in Havana. What they called the first try Continental

tri continent Asia Africa Latin America the first tri Continental

solidarity conference and they plan their this subversion of the rest of Asia

Africa and Latin America. Mr Castro announced on television so everybody in

Florida and so on could hear that Cuba is to be to the Western

Hemisphere what North Vietnam is to South Vietnam. That's just as plain as they could say it.

Cuba is the place where the agents and the dissidents born in Panama are born in

Guatemala born in Colombia Brazil Ecuador Bolivia.

But one of the revolutionists not patriots of the country where they were born when Europe

become a communist you were not now a Russian patriot or a Chinese pages or an American

patriot. You're a cancer cell. You have abandoned

rejected the law abiding processes of growth of your own nation your a world revolution

is. And just as the leaders of the Viet Cong have been trained in

North Vietnam and supply and directed and then

transported down down into South Vietnam or from these

training schools they have in Cuba transported back into the western hemisphere

to to subvert from within. Suppose they get third base and they want a

home base don't think what's home to the North Atlantic Western

Europe has three hundred twenty five million people the largest body of skilled competent

trained manpower in the world. Our side of the Atlantic has almost two hundred twenty five

million United States and Canada. If these five hundred fifty million really were

united the president wouldn't have to be sending over emissaries

pleading with the North Vietnamese to come and negotiate ho demanded have to

come voluntarily to negotiate and on the free world's terms but we're not united.

Our alliances as they say in Washington buzz are in disarray which is

Washington's word for a mess. Now Lenin said this

except they didn't use baseball terms he said back in 22 or 23 the

way to Paris. That is the North Atlantic is through Peking and

Calcutta which was then the capital of India. There's no secret about it.

Heat modern first base don't give them second to let alone third and home base now how do you

do that. There are two ways one is and even one's positive the negative is don't do anything to

help. Nobody loses by being assisted to win. You know

that means you mustn't trade within their system with all their

great leap forward says not sound and they've got shortages compared mainland

China and preach China on Taiwan. This one a shambles this one

the most effective and really sensational illustration of what

three people will do given a chance to work for development without internal

disorder that there is on the planet today. Their

system is in trouble. Keep them in trouble don't help them out by

supplying debt surpluses or the products that our system provides

or encourages and enables people to produce and supply them with the

things that will enable him or give them a better hope of replacing our system which

works with their system which doesn't work. Second

don't give them the smashing victory which official diplomatic

representation would recognition would need.

We don't need to recognize them to deal with them. Britain recognize Red China

in one thousand forty nine and her ambassador has yet not yet

been honored with being received by miles of them personally the Asia watches

the white man being held outside the door waiting now almost

20 years whereas we have been dealing with the communist almost

every month since 54. We've had official dealings with them

in conferences at ppl in Warsaw and various other

places.

If the United States accepts embraces read Red China can

anybody else resister. That's the show.

And third this is why Red China must be brought into the United Nations until she

qualifies for membership until she qualifies. Frequently you've heard people

say we got our heads in the sand we're rigid stubborn blank pretending that Red

China isn't there denying her existence keeping your out of the United Nations.

Now let me be rough.

That is totally inexcusable misrepresentation of our position.

We are not stubbornly rigidly keeping Red China out of the United Nations. She is

stubbornly rigidly keeping herself out because she announces she will not

qualify for membership.

The door is wide open. We offered over 70 times to sponsor

their membership in the UN if they will qualify and what do they have to do to qualify.

Well read the United Nations charter. It hasn't even been re written by any of our American

courts as yet and you can read it and find out.

It says membership shall yet membership is open to other peace loving nations that will

accept the obligations of the charter. What's the first obligation to read Crean

from the threat or use some force in international dispute. That's all they have to

do. But most of them score with my scout is over the use of force he said you've got to use

force political power comes only out of the barrel of a gun.

All he has to do is abandon We've never asked him to abandon his claim to Taiwan

to agree not to use force the issue was about how our international disputes to be settled.

He announces the UN's got to come to him. The mountains got to come to mama

not Moll adjust himself to the monkey. Please don't wreck the UN.

Some of us to work for world organization. That would be effective long before the

UN came into being.

It's because I want a better United Nations more effective even more united that I don't

that I advocate not bringing in until it qualifies outfits that you know will

make it weaker and more disunited.

This is the negative don't help winning. Now what's the positive the positive the

do all you reasonably can that is within the reasonable limits of

limits so our resources and with due regard to our other obligations including those at home

do all we reasonably can to strengthen the countries around China. And here you

come to Vietnam again. Because it's the key to those that are

being there you must strengthen because that's where they're coming. They're trying to come down through this weak spot.

Now how are we doing in Vietnam militarily we've been doing much better

including the events that have happened in the last few days. For example the

Vietnamese army is very much better than it was. Two years

ago as late as one year some people thought that you couldn't make a good army out of

Vietnam. There are many reasons for that. In the more Orient particularly where you have a

Confucian background the lowest order of society is the military and the

highest is the scholar. And they sent out into the military

government and the people who would become pugs and gangsters and gunman and

racketeers and the students were they were the intelligencia they were

exempt. They would never resort to force to get their hands.

Now it takes a while believe me to change it so that it becomes praiseworthy NPP

Riady and honorable to go into the military. But when I was out

there last fall it was clear that the Vietcong military

establishment had improved enormously much better.

And as been proved in recent weeks they have not won. There has been not

been one outfit in South Vietnam that darn it down its arms and ran away.

Up until a year ago the Vietnamese South Vietnam my IIS army was losing

about one weapon to the Viet Cong to every weapon it was getting back and

all of last year when they were a bit calm. It would be a Congress

losing about 2 weapon to 1 they were getting back and the defections

from the Viet Cong to the free Vietnamese were more in the first six months of

67 than in all of nineteen sixty six.

The tide was turning and it I say not one outfit in

this recent striking from within hasn't thrown down its arms and run.

Now they were caught asleep. Why I suppose they read the New York Times and some of the

American papers which said that Hu Jia man is just a Vietnamese Patriot this is

a civil war. Well if he's a Vietnamese then he

will respect the lunar calendar. After all North Vietnam

proposed and announced the six day truce. And

Vietnamese don't go out and go to war during the lunar

holiday.

They announced and proposed and announce the six day truce on the first day when all

the Vietnamese or did what they've always done had a holiday and took

leave. And the attack came right then if you have any doubts as to whether they're trying in this or

Vietnamese. They demonstrated it in only three weeks ago.

Second Vietnamese is better politically if we force them to have

five elections in 14 months that's not too bad.

They didn't want to do it. This isn't their way of choosing their leaders but they had to do it in order to

satisfy us. We wanted a legitimate by our methods so they did it.

So their government is stronger politically and the Kabit Khan

only captured papers makes perfectly clear they thought. I guess again they'd been reading

the speeches of senators that the government of Vietnam is so one popular and it's so rotten

and the people are so against it. And not one city not

one grows up and were turned over to the Viet Cong.

Not a one welcomed him.

The government is stronger with all of its weaknesses than we have been given it credit. It's better

off economically. There's a bad black market there no question about it but

not nearly as bad as it was in Korea believe me. Now the US position is stronger

out there in the beginning we couldn't do much because we didn't have the base.

There was only one deepwater port and it took 50 to 65

days for a ship to come in get up to the border unload and get out. And

now in these first two years of our effort out there beginning in February

30 65 we've got six deepwater ports and the longest any ship

had been in harbor in any of these in this first nine months of this year was seven

days mostly three to five. Three years ago there was only there

were only three ports that would take airports that would take Jets one good one into

winter which you could squeak. Now we have eight good

airports some with the runways at long last. It's

possible to put pressure on the adversary and then

the screening begins in our country then we should be doing that which we've spent

two years getting ready to do You can't build a building until you get the foundations in.

There's been real progress. You may say

is there any hope in this kind of a policy. Yes there is.

Take for example three two years ago just now Mr.

Senator Fulbright held hearings in the Senate Foreign Relations Committee on what our

policy should be with respect to this part of the world and a whole series of so-called

experts testified 30 to 11 days. Most of them hadn't

had much experience with the communist but it was obvious they had at least read each other's books.

And this one. Is there a line number one the communists are

there too.

They have united the people of China. They said the people of China have

accepted communism they said they're better off under it. They said the regime in

Peking is stable. It's in secure and permanent and complete control

of the China mainland. Ergo we must be practical and accept

communist China and North Vietnam as a permanent fact.

That sounded pretty plausible but events proved as some people thought

would be the case that the premises of those conclusions were not sound.

And within three months after the experts testified events in China

proved one that the people of China had not accepted communism too.

They were not better off under it. Most of them talk to you the swimmin they were

swimming three four five six hundred every month them Akala that many

got there nobody knows how many died in the room. I haven't heard anybody risking their life to swim into

mainland China at you.

And third the regime in Peking stable by it was torn from top to bottom

United.

War going on between the washouts he and his faction and most of them

over what it is that's incredible in Communism

don't don't don't give up on human beans.

I will never accept as permanent that which enslaves the human mind

or the body it can do it temporarily.

Don't sell man short. Or if you aren't sure about man please don't sell God

sure the universe is not on this side of this. History is not on the side

of this and the pessimists who

get overwhelmed by those little setbacks. I think we

ought to take a longer look at history. In short the Tyee

had turned militarily and politically out there.

Thanks first to the tenacity of the South Vietnamese and the other reason

for the changing is the plea of the of the direction is the clear headedness the

courage and the skill and devotion and heroism

of the Americans and the Koreans and the Australians and so on.

I found great confused by angry confusion in the United States but I found less

confusion in Vietnam now as a result of these changes.

The Communists can't win militarily.

Then why don't they come and negotiate. Because every time there's a so-called peace

demonstration in the United States it leads holds human to think that we will lose.

Why should he give up. Take a first down as long as there's a chance

to get a home run or to get a touch I should say.

And if we just didn't talk about bot negotiations all the time. And

appears so anxious we'd better have better chances of getting them. I

once heard one of my daughters say to her younger sister if you want that boy don't you see

and she had more sense than our government. Don't

Cherry seems whole let him come. Keep the door open.

But every time we do so we go. They hold out for us that makes more and more

concessions. Our eagerness for negotiations

reduces our chance of getting them.

Hold human has for hopes one disorders and self Vietnam and he's

trying his level best to create them. I don't think he can do it now.

They are sure we will stand firm.

The problem always is a vicious circle of how to get development

and security. How do you get about what might housing help highways a

better living standard agricultural reform. As long as there's insecurity all the time. And

how do you get security unless the people are sure that by turning in those pumps

their own government will make possible better living conditions and education and health and so on

for the families and their children.

You have to get group security and development but the only place you can break that vicious circle

is that security not report person security.

Then as has been proved in Korea and every other country the coarsest for repealing

it within are irresistible.

Given security you will not find the Vietnamese giving up

the second hold because disunity is especially among the European allies.

The third hope is the capacity of the world communist movement with its

cells everywhere trained to create disruptions

disruptions in the Middle East I think you will find that step up there are not

disruptions in Korea.

Believe me the Pueblo was more of a defeat for us than anything that's

happened in Vietnam because it showed the world that the great United

States either can't or won't. I don't know which.

But the results are the same.

You either can't or won't defend its own armed forces on the high

seas.

I repeat what I said at the beginning. Who wants to be an ally of a paper tiger.

Paul being that perhaps forcing the Koreans to bring home

their 40000 50000 men some of the best troops in

South Vietnam forcing us to divert the enterprise and other things to the north. If they can

force us to be by under what the communist have always talked about

simultaneous struggles in half a dozen places or even

two then whole G-men hanging on may be able to pull through.

But their best hope is not disorders in South Vietnam or divisions

in Europe or disruptions in other countries it's it's divisions

and doubts and demonstrations even

disorders in the United States.

My friends the critical front just now is not Vietnam. It's here in the

United States.

The urgent need now is not better military leadership from civilians in

Washington but better political leadership from civilians in Washington.

I don't think that can be pulled together unless the people at the top treat the American people the way

Churchill treated the British people who lay it on the line however badly we're

not weak. But if our leaders come to a conclusion but don't

present to us frankly the evidence which led them to that conclusion we are not going

to accept that when they say we must support them but we'll support our country and we'll

support our cause if they if the considerations the facts which led

them to this conclusion are presented to us.

In short I think we must give lesser weight in this immediate future to the possible

but less likely risks for example that Red China would intervene.

Our government under civilians adopted military policies government civilians should

decide whether we get in but once we're in then I think we

ought to pay some attention to the experts. I don't know what we've been spending hundreds of millions of

dollars every year to train experts in military operation and West Point Annapolis and

Colorado Springs.

And then when we get into an operation in this regard the specialist we've trained hundreds of millions

training.

We spend hundreds of millions training I repeat I don't think our new civilian leadership

should have got us into this but we're there. And why haven't we done some of these

things that the military charged with the carrying on of the operation

wanted and their professional judgment told him we should do.

Well it said Red China will intervene but he she liked it too for

several reasons. If she were to intervene down here with her masses she would be inviting

and justifying our destruction of her nuclear facility.

Second how would he supply his masses down here. Third his best

troops are tied up on the mainland almost a million of them watching Taiwan.

They're not free to leave that mainland and go down here.

He's got others up along the border with the Soviet Union and now with the internal difficulties he's got to

keep his most dependable troops at home to keep himself in power we've been given an

opportunity when we don't need to prevail. Dear China it's the least likely

of all the dangers. Well what is said if we were to go ahead and abandon this policy of

gradualism which means that that we escalate only after

the other side escalates when they get their Ana aircraft in and

their SAM missiles so they can shoot down our aviators then we allow our

aviators to attack those targets. There was a time when people say the way to

win a war is to get the most us there first US. This war is being fought on Beat

be played and be sure and don't get there first. But only after

the other side's got the weapons in to shoot down our boy.

I don't like to say this I've opposed it all the way along but that's what we've been doing.

What I'm saying is if you're going to do this get in then get the operational word and the

forgetting begins and the healing begins and there are things to look forward to.

You drag it on indefinitely and you'll have a dead patient. You can't operate

forever. You can't put five or six hundred thousand corners into that little

country strong aggressive hard driving corners with most of the

power and most of the money without destroying the fabric of that little country and you

have a successful operation perhaps and a dead patient that's a

right risk you better pay attention to it.

The greater risks in this gradualism are your giving time for

the communists in China to get missiles developed with which they can

use deliberate nuclear weapons on the United States.

You're encouraging the Soviet Union to commit itself seeing our

hesitation it may get its neck out too far and once it's crossed the

Rubicon. How does it back down and then you have the world Room country to

Greece in which we don't want it because I don't want a world country Greece and I want

us to follow the policy of firmness and strength not belligerence.

Chip on her shoulder. Which without exception has led to

de-escalation and improvement in the situation.

What we should do in the south is hold and help.

But you don't win just by holding and helping in the south. The remember

that the objective in a military struggle is political. Your objective is to

change the will of the adversary. Now what is likely to change the

will hold you meant killing people in the south while we constantly reassure

him that nothing serious is going to happen to his regime in the north.

Now he'll come and negotiate when the pressure on him in the

north is such that it's too dangerous for him not to come and negotiate.

What then is you to do in the north about three or four things one is maybe too

late for this one. Let the South Vietnamese what they do what they beg to

do under President GM and then under General key organize the Liberation

Front in the north. More than a million of them almost a million of

them came from the north. They know where the keys are they know where the Patmos are they know where

the hidden roads are. They know their own people and they want to go back as

guerrillas to interrupt things in the north the way the North is doing in the south but we wouldn't let them

because we mustn't offend the enemy.

A second thing we must do is have a what I would call a Kennedy blockade.

It was dangerous in Cuba and it would be

dangerous you might say in Haifa but I don't think I'll be blunt.

Our government has a right to ask a one of you to go over there and give these lie.

If our government is not prepared to do all it can to reduce the capacity of the

North to get the weapons with which it takes your life. And the

third thing I think we have to do is have more important or more effective attacks

upon more important targets the in the year 1966 67

figures weren't available 99 percent plus of all the flights were

against targets that weren't sufficiently important for the Joint Chiefs of Staff to have more on

their list.

Fly right over every day the airfield or the SAM missiles are being assembled and

we saw and took pictures of it for two years and three months.

And finally let our own men bomb that field last October after 68

planes had been shot down American planes and 80 and lost their lives by those

same missiles we were which we watched them assemble. If they found a buffalo down the road they

could should bomb the buffalo but not the base where the SAM missiles were putting in.

And one more and this is the humanitarian one I don't know why we haven't used it its

right use Ronnie's 85 percent of the rice is grown in an

isosceles triangle from home on Hanoi down to the Gulf of Tonkin King and about

100 miles along the Gulf and its grown in

irrigated paddy fields. The Red River comes down 20 to 25 feet

above the fields and their sluice gates to let the water out to irrigate. And

if you break those dikes they lose their rice crop.

Well we couldn't bomb and scars are women and

children. We have in every other war.

This would be mercyful better than kill them it seems to me and turn them to pieces. And furthermore

we can tell them to call off the aggression and we'll help you rebuild them and we'll keep you for

one crop. So you want Starr call off the operation. If that's

cruel and Abraham Lincoln was a barbarian because he burned the wheat

crops in the Shenandoah Valley and he sent Sherman down through the south to

destroy the food of this out of all the methods this is the least

any humanitarian.

I just hope that our government will out of this experience of the last few

weeks recognize that this is an enemy of ours.

I said at the beginning this is a watershed. If we can

humiliate us goes that way. On the other hand if we prevail as we

can and as we will if we understand the watershed goes the other way.

Ladies and gentlemen Vietnam is the test

not of our power but of our understanding and of our

insights. And perhaps I suppose you would say our

character as a people as a nation today. I

welcome the opportunity to talk to you about these jam and these things. Don't take

my word or anybody else's without examining. The hope that the world is in

you.

Arrive.

US you've been listening to an address by Dr. Walter Judd

former United States congressman from Minnesota. Doctor Judd spoke in the series

as we see it Vietnam 68. This form of opinion featuring noted

spokesmen on the war in Vietnam was sponsored by the Miami University student senate

and organized by Dave speller Berg recording an editing was done by Miami

University Radio. This is national educational radio.