WMST-L LOG9411A ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 31 Oct 1994 13:41:00 EDT Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: "Jane M. Barstow" Subject: women and aging excuse this reply to the entire list but let me recommend to everyone interested in women and aging Edith Wharton's "The Pretext," about a woman who sees herself quite differently when she looks in the mirror depending on whether or not she feels loved by an attractive young man. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 05:38:47 MST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List Comments: Converted from PROFS to RFC822 format by PUMP V2.2 From: Lahoucine Ouzgane Subject: Lit. postcolonialism/feminism Two works by Algerian women on the subject: Marnia Lazreg, THE ELOQUENCE OF SILENCE: ALGERIAN WOMEN IN QUESTION. Routledge, 1994 Assia Djebar. A SISTER TO SCHEHERAZADE. Tran. Dorothy Blair. Quartet Books, 1987. Hope this helps. Lahoucine Ouzgane -------------------------------------------------- Lahoucine Ouzgane University of Alberta ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 08:14:22 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Cheryl Sattler Subject: Creating Safe Space for Women in Classrooms I hope someone will be able to respond to this request. I have a good friend who has been doing the preliminary research for her dissertation. As a feminist psychologist, she began by looking at gender equity studies of classrooms, etc. There I could help her, as a sociologist and an educator. However, she has now shifted to trying to find out how one goes about creating safe space (similar to that safe space we create in a counseling relationship, or in a women's shelter) for women in co-ed classes--particularly in non-women's studies classrooms, such as the general psychology courses she teaches. Any key literature would be helpful. Please respond privately, unless it seems of general interest to the list. Cheryl _________________ Cheryl Sattler, Ph.D. Florida State University FAX (904) 644-0643 PHONE (904) 644-1142 internet: sattler@bio.fsu.edu ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 08:19:07 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: "Robin L. Roth" Subject: Women's Studies course criteria Colleagues, We are developing a Women's Studies major and are discussing the criteria needed for a course to be included/defined as "women's studies." I would like to hear what criteria other programs have decided on when including a course as a "women's studies" course. Please respond privately, Thank you. J. Periale Lesley College les_roth@flo.org ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 08:46:43 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Joan Korenman Subject: Re: Women's Studies course criteria J. Periale writes: > I would like to hear what criteria other programs have decided > on when including a course as a "women's studies" course. I am replying publicly since this topic continues to be of broad interest, and many new subscribers have joined WMST-L since the last time the issue came up. You may want to look at the WMST-L file CROSSLST POLICIES, (send the message GET CROSSLST POLICIES to LISTSERV@UMDD.UMD.EDU, and note the strange spelling of CROSSLST). That file contains information from several institutions about what criteria/procedures they have for including courses in their WS programs, including an earlier version of the following from UMBC that we send to the course's instructor: ***************************************************** COURSE APPROVAL FOR THE WOMEN'S STUDIES CURRICULUM Univ. of Maryland - Baltimore County Baltimore, Maryland 21228-5398 In order for your course to be approved for inclusion in the Women's Studies curriculum, the Women's Studies Coordinating Committee needs information about the course. We do not ask or even desire that faculty toe a narrow ideological line; we do ask that courses designated WMST be informed by contemporary Women's Studies scholarship and provide students with an understanding of feminist perspectives. We would thus appreciate your sending the following information: 1) a detailed course description or syllabus, including the list of readings and a description of your teaching method 2) your responses to the following three questions: a) is the central focus of the course gender roles, women's issues, and/or the status of or portrayal of women in history, the arts, or the sciences? Please explain. b) how does the course material reflect knowledge of contemporary feminist scholarship about women? c) why do you feel that this is a Women's Studies course rather than just a course about women or gender? The committee would also welcome any additional materials that might help in assessing the course's suitability for inclusion in the Women's Studies curriculum. Please send all course information to Joan Korenman, Director, Women's Studies Program, UMBC, Baltimore, Md. 21228-5398 (or, on campus, Joan Korenman, Women's Studies Program, Fine Arts 452). If you prefer, you may fax the information to (410) 455-1030 (please be sure Joan Korenman's name is on the first page), or email it to korenman@umbc2.umbc.edu. Many thanks. ************************************************** Good luck! Joan Korenman Internet: korenman@umbc2.umbc.edu Bitnet: korenman@umbc ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 14:48:35 +0100 Reply-To: sag@xs4all.nl Sender: Women's Studies List From: sag Subject: Internet Women scared Hi I'm doing a little survey for an article on friendships and sexism on Internet and I'm looking for people who're willing to tell me their experiences. The article is to be published in a weekly for teenagers in Holland. The public here is just getting to know Internet and many women and girl(students) are scared off after their first experiences on internet, as they encounter sexism. If you have experienced forms of sexism and you're willing to share them, please specificate if this happened on irc, in a newsgroup, if this newsgroup was female only, male only or mixed, if this experience was followed by e-mail persuance, what you did or can do to avoid all this. I'm also interested in positiv stories, men or women standing up for each other, friendships between males and females or females and females, etc. thanks a lot, Marisa de Melker sag@xs4all.nl ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 08:50:00 EDT Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Joan Korenman Subject: Format for WMST-L Messages (User's Guide) Each month, I post sections from the WMST-L User's Guide to remind subscribers of the list's resources and procedures. If changes have been made since the last time a section was posted, the subject header will begin "Revision:". Also, you can now consult the User's Guide anytime you'd like if you have access to gopher. Gopher to gopher.umbc.edu and select Academic Department Info (currently #5), then Women's Studies (currently #9), then WMST-L (currently #5). Meanwhile, here is the first section, dealing with the suggested format for WMST-L messages. PLEASE PAY ATTENTION TO WHAT IT SAYS: ******************** 1) "IS THERE A PREFERRED FORMAT TO USE FOR MESSAGES SENT TO THE LIST (I.E., TO WMST-L@UMDD OR WMST-L@UMDD.UMD.EDU)?" Yes. First of all, ALWAYS put your name and e-mail address at the end of every posting. (It is important that people be able to contact you privately if they wish, and some mail systems do not identify the writer anywhere in the header.) Also, please include a meaningful subject heading, so that people will know whether your message deals with a topic of interest to them. (MANY people automatically delete messages with no subject heading or with one that doesn't interest them.) Finally, if you are replying to someone else's posting, BRIEFLY quote or summarize that posting before you offer your reply. Doing so will make your message clearer and avoid confusion. (New subscribers are continually joining the list; they may not have read the original message. And since a number of topics are often being discussed on the list at any given moment, even long-time subscribers may not remember what prompted your remarks unless you remind them.) NOTE: if you're replying to a long message, do NOT quote it in its entirety! Include just a few relevant lines. ******************* Joan Korenman Internet: korenman@umbc2.umbc.edu Bitnet: korenman@umbc ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 09:03:02 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: "Sarah M. Pritchard" Subject: Congrats to Korenman WMST-L subscribers can now see the person who so adeptly and thoughtfully operates this list! In this week's Chronicle of Higher Education (11/2/95), page A26, is a great photo of Joan Korenman, accompanied by numerous quotes, part of a longer article on listservs and the internet as an evolving scholarly conversation space. The article only begins to scratch the surface of how our many layers of scholarly and civic interchange are being shaped by new communications channels and forums -- but I for one appreciated seeing the humanity behind the bytes! Sarah Pritchard Smith College Libraries spritchard@smith.edu ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 09:34:40 -0500 Reply-To: Mary Petrie Sender: Women's Studies List From: Mary Petrie Subject: Feminism critique of AA Greetings, A while ago someone on the list mentioned an article critiquing the Alcoholics Anonymous Twelve Step program. I wrote down the info and now can't find it anywhere; I've done the usual library searches and still no luck. I think the author was Betty Tallen or Talbot. If anyone knows about such an article, I'd greatly appreciate more info. Also, I'm writing my own feminist critique of AA (especially how it is adapted for eating disorders) and would appreciate any tips on books, articles, or bits of personal perspectives. PLEASE RESPOND PRIVATELY: Mary Petrie petr0013@gold.tc.umn.edu ************************* Mary Petrie Commission on Women & Dept. of English University of Minnesota Minneapolis MN 55455 612-626-8780 FAX 612-624-5223 petr0013@gold.tc.umn.edu ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 11:07:18 LCL Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: houghton charles Subject: Re: aging and appearance hi! although "look me in the eye" by barbara macdonald does not focus soley on aging and appearance, i feel it contains information which may be useful to you. good luck! loralee clark college of william and mary ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 11:20:49 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Elizabeth Mastro Subject: Re: aging and appearance In-Reply-To: <199411010025.TAA14156@holmes.umd.edu> Hi. You might take a look at Betty Freidan's Fountain of Age. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 11:31:10 -0600 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Laura Sullivan Subject: WS major and Departments Would the good people who responded (on 10/31) to my request about WS departmentalization and WS majors and who wanted the information I receive, please send me their addresses again? I lost your messages. Sorry--Laura Sullivan 304 Stiven House 708 S. Mathews Urbana, IL 61801 laurasul@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 11:53:08 -0600 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: wood gretchen ann Subject: maternal employment & child academic achievement HI! I am trying to do research regarding maternal employment and academic achievement in children. My data set is mostly 2-parent families with kindergarten/first grade children. I am having dificulty finding research that correlates maternal employent to autonomy/engagment in school/achievement. My main interest is this relation to girls, however, I will be looking at boys as well. Any suggestions? Gretchen Wood University of Illinois gretchen@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 12:55:49 EST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Kathy Feltey Subject: Re: maternal employment & child academic achievement In-Reply-To: Message of Tue, 1 Nov 1994 11:53:08 -0600 from Betty Megnahan and Toby Parcel have examined this question and I think report their findings in their new book (I don't have the title in front of me). They also have published their findings in various journal articles. Good luck! Kathy Feltey ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 14:36:02 -0600 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Patricia Owen Thge post on creating a safe place for women in college classrooms intriges me. I'm not sure what this is about. Clarification from anyone? ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 12:41:59 -0700 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Diane Price Herndl Subject: Re: Creating Safe Space for Women in Classrooms In-Reply-To: <199411011316.IAA01141@holmes.umd.edu> On Tue, 1 Nov 1994, Cheryl Sattler wrote: > she has now shifted to trying to find out how one goes > about creating safe space (similar to that safe space we create in a > counseling relationship, or in a women's shelter) for women in co-ed > classes--particularly in non-women's studies classrooms, such as the > general psychology courses she teaches. > > Any key literature would be helpful. Please respond privately, unless it > seems of general interest to the list. > > Cheryl Could I ask that either the replies be public or that Cheryl provide a compilation? This seems to me exactly the kind of question the list is intended for. Diane Price Herndl NMSU English Dept. dpherndl@nmsu.edu ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 15:46:59 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Susan MacFarland Subject: Status of Women in India I'm teaching a Comparative Politics class in which students (who are all women; we're at a women's college) are looking for information about the status of women in various regions of the world. We are having difficulty finding up-to-date data on women in India. Any suggestions? Thanks in advance. SMacFarland@wesmail.wesleyan.peachnet.edu. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 15:48:00 EDT Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Joan Korenman Subject: seek info re women scientists outside USA I received the following message today from Lauren Foley, whose email address appears below. If you wish to reply, please do so PRIVATELY to that address. DO NOT REPLY TO WMST-L!! Foley is not a subscriber and will not see your message unless you reply privately. Thanks. Joan Korenman **************************************************************** I'm writing from WGBH, the public television station in Boston. We're producing a series on women in science this spring, and I'm coordinating the classroom materials to support the program. What I'm looking for right now is information about women scientists from outside the USA. Any time, any country - we're creating an international map of women's accomplishments in science. Any help you can provide (preferably in the next week or so) would be great. Could you also circulate this request to other networks that might help? Thanks very much in advance. Lauren Foley WGBH Educational Foundation 125 Western Ave, Boston MA 02134 (617) 492-2777, ext. 3769 fax (617) 787-1639 Lauren_Foley@wgbh.org ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 15:26:02 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Jo Hinchliffe Subject: Joint Apointment: English/Women's Studies In-Reply-To: <9410271817.AB23784@unixg.ubc.ca> TENURE TRACK POSITION IN WOMEN'S STUDIES AND THE DEPARTMENT OF ENGLISH Applications are invited for a tenure-track Assistant Professorship to be held jointly in the Department of English and the Women's Studies Programme, to commence on 1 July, 1995 (subject to final budget review). Applications are also welcomed from senior women scholars for potential appointment at a higher rank. Candidates should have expertise in one of the following areas: Renaissance Studies, including Shakespeare; Nineteenth-Century or Twentieth-Century Studies, with a focus upon British, American, Canadian, or Commonwealth/Postcolonial Literature. Candidates should alo have research and teaching strengths in Women's Studies, and a commitment to curricular development in this area. The requirements are a completed Ph.D., evidence of published scholarship, and some teaching experience at the post-secondary level. Salary will be weighted according to qualifications and experience. Applications should send a current c.v. and a writing sample, and arrange for three letters of reference to be forwarded to Dr. Herbert Rosengarten, Head, Department of English, University of British Columbia, 397-1873 East Mall, Vancouver, B.C., CANADA V6T 1Z1 Applications must be received by 30, December 1994. In accordance with Canadian immigration requirements, this advertisement is directed to Canadian citizens and permanent residents. The University of British Columbia welcomes all qualified applicants, especially women, aboriginal people, visible minorities and persons with disabilities. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 14:33:42 -0800 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Deborah Maranville Subject: Swedish, Norwegian, German prostitution laws (fwd) Cross-posted to WMST and Femjur One of my students is doing a law review paper on legal responses to child prostitution and the sex tourism industry in Thailand. She has found references to laws in Norway, and Germany that authorize prostitution of citizens of the country based on prostitution related activities in other countries, but has been unable to track down the citations that would allow her to get copies of the statutes. (She is writing letters to sources suggested by some of the consulates, but her deadlines make waiting for replies difficult.) In addition, she has the Swedish law, but is interested in the results of prosecutions that she understands were pending last year. If anyone on has easy access to the citations, or has information on the existence or status of prosecutions under those laws she would be most grateful. Reply privately to me. Thanks. Debbie Maranville University of Washington School of Law 1100 N.E. Campus Parkway Seattle, WA 98105 (206) 543-3434 ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 18:39:00 EST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: RHODA UNGER Subject: Feminist theory syllabi? The director of our women's studies program, Linda Levine (who is not on this network) would like some sample syllabi for an advanced undergraduate or beginning graduate course in feminist theory. If you can help her out, please contact her on email or via snail mail. Her email address is: levinel@saturn.montclair.edu and her snail mail address is: Dr. Linda Levine Director of Women's Studies Academic Building B Montclair State University Upper Montclair, NJ 07043 Thanks, Rhoda Unger ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 19:10:04 EST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: lin collette Subject: any good feminist bookstores in Albuquerque? I'm heading to Albuquerque for a meeting from 11/3 through 11/6, and I was wondering if anyone on this list knows of good feminist bookstores in Albuquer- que. Please reply privately to me as I've set WMST-L nomail due to the usual crunch of work one experiences just before traveling. thanks much. lin collette bi599128@brownvm.brown.edu ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 14:35:49 +1200 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Lynne Alice Subject: Men and feminism Can anyone suggest three well-articulated books (or readings) on the relationship of men and/in feminism ... for a first year course. Lynne Alice ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 21:03:17 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Jo Hinchliffe Subject: Joint Appointment Anthropology/Sociology and Women's Studies In-Reply-To: <9410250843.AB28979@unixg.ubc.ca> TENURE TRACK POSITION IN WOMEN'S STUDIES AND THE DEPARTMENT OF ANTHROPOLOGY AND SOCIOLOGY Applications are invited for a tenure-track Assistant Professorship to be held jointly in the Women's Studies Programme and the Department of Anthropology and Sociology, to commence on July 1, 1995 (subject to final budget review). Applications are also welcomed from senior women scholars for potential appointment at a higher rank. Candidates should have research and teaching strengths in Anthropology/Archaeology or Sociology, Women's Studies in the Social Sciences, and a commitment to curricular development in Women's Studies. The requirements are a completed Ph.D., evidence of published scholarship, and some teaching experience at the post-secondary level. Salary will be weighted according to qualifications and experience. Applicants should send a current c.v. and writing sample, and arrange for three letters of reference to be forwarded to : Dr. Richard Pearson, Head, Department of Anthropology & Sociology, University of British Columbia, 6303 N.W. Marine Drive, Vancouver, B.C. V6T 1Z1 Applications must be received by 31 December 1994. In accordance with Canadian immigration requirements, this advertisement is directed to Canadian citizens and permanent residents. The University of British Columbia welcomes all qualified applicants, especially women, aboriginal people, visible minorities, and persons with disabilities. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 19:16:38 -0700 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Karen Anderson Subject: maternal employment and child achievement My reaction to this project is that it is fraught with political danger in a context where women's autonomy and achievement (also at stake here) is often associated with damage to children (read "sons"). Are there studies that look at paternal employment (hours worked, involvement with children, and level of travel) and their effects on the achievements of sons and daughters or their effects on the characters and politics of sons and daughters? Karen Anderson University of Arizona karena@ccit.arizona.edu ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Nov 1994 23:32:17 -0600 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: beverly randall Subject: Re: Creating Safe Space for Women in Classrooms On 11/1/94 Cheryl Sattler wrote concerning the research of a friend: >However, she has now shifted to trying to find out how one goes >about creating safe space (similar to that safe space we create in a >counseling relationship, or in a women's shelter) for women in co-ed >classes--particularly in non-women's studies classrooms, such as the >general psychology courses she teaches. I, like some others who have posted messages concerning this subject, would like to know better what is meant by "safe." It seems problematic to me, even disturbing. The image of a women's shelter or any kind of shelter for that matter seems contrary to the educational needs of the contemporary multicultural classroom. I hope that by remaining open to my students' varying points of departure, experiences and opinions that a safe place for debate is created. Ideally, the students feel they aren't judged on their opinions but are encouraged to speak no matter what they may have to say relevant to the topic of discussion. Sometimes students are rebutted immediately by others in the class. Controversy is good. I usually remain quiet unless a devil's advocate is required (which would of course be my own judgement and involve my own politics). I'm new at this, I guess, and have yet to encounter sexism that isn't immediately picked up by my female students. I realize that my imagination is a product of my culture but the image of creating a "safe space for women" in my classroom also conjures up the very disagreable image of the female professor as a mother hen, warding off all the cocks who seem a little too forthright. Are male professors expected to create this haven as well? Please excuse me if I've misinterpreted what you mean by "safe." Beverly Randall Dept. of French and Italian University of Texas at Austin bev@mail.utexas.edu ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 07:24:16 EST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Jo Freeman Subject: stopping the myth about sex in Title VII The following is a copy of a lettr I just wrote to MS. magazine concerning an a rticle they printed containing false information on Title VII of the 1964 Civil Rights Act. Since that article has been reprinted in textbooks, I'm posting th is letter to various lists in hopes of disuading teachers and scholars from per petrating the myth. Please excuse my bad typing. This program doesn't edit ea sily. Ms. Magazine 230 Park Ave. New York, NY 10169 Dear Ms.: This letter is 18 months too late, but I feel compelled to write you anyway in hopes you won't repeat the error you made when youpublished "The Civi l Rights History of 'Sex': A Sexist, Racist Congressional Joke" by Elizabeth Ro th in yourMarch/April 1993 issue. I just found it reprinted in a new women's studies textbook published, I'm ashamed to say, by myown publisher, Mayfield. This article perpetuates the myth that "sex" was added to the prohibited discri minations of Title VII of the 1964 Civil Rights Act as a "sexist, racist Congre ssonal joke" by a die hard segregatoinist, Howard W. Smith of Virginia, and tht our Congress passively went along with it. By the time you published this article this thesis had been effectively di scredited by at least two serious scholars, myself and Carl M. Brauer. His Feb ruary 1983 article in The Journal of Southern History established that Smith's support was not spurious, and however jocular he sounded on the day of the floo r debate, he did not sponsor the amendment as a joke. After several years of a rchival research I asked "How Sex Got Into Title VII" in my 1991 article in The Journal of Law and Inequality. The moving force behind the "sex" amendment was the National Woman's Party, and their members' reasons for pushing it had nothing to do with sexism or racism; nor were they joking. Some day someone should research how this myth became history. (I have a h unch, butI haven't researched it). In the meantime, MS. is the last publicatio n that should accept it without question and it shouldn't be reprinted in wom en's studies textbooks where it will mislead future generations of students. Sincerely, Jo Freeman, Ph.D., J.D. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 08:16:51 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Cheryl Sattler Subject: Safe Space Messages I have received several replies, private and to the list, asking for a compilation. I will post one to the list--but the more the better! Thanks for all of your (continuing) help. Cheryl _________________ Cheryl Sattler, Ph.D. Florida State University FAX (904) 644-0643 PHONE (904) 644-1142 internet: sattler@bio.fsu.edu ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 08:30:01 -0400 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: "Joan D. Mandle" Subject: Re: Creating Safe Space for Women in Classrooms Cheryl writes that we need to create "safe space in classrooms for women which is similar to that safe space we create in a counseling relationship or a women's shelter." I feel that comparing the goals of a classroom to a therapeutic relationship is extremely dangerous, for it eliminates the possibility of serious disagreement - even conflict - about ideas which I believe to be necessary for real learning to go on. A classroom should be "safe space" for all students but only in the sense that they are free there to exchange ideas, explore differing points of view, and to open themselves up to challenges to their own points of view. Joan D. Mandle jdmandle@center.colgate.edu ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 09:22:00 EDT Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Joan Korenman Subject: how to unsubscribe, etc. (User's Guide) Each month, I post sections from the WMST-L User's Guide to remind subscribers of the list's resources and procedures. If changes have been made since the last time a section was posted, the subject header will begin "Revision:". Also, you can now consult the User's Guide anytime you'd like if you have access to gopher. Gopher to gopher.umbc.edu and select Academic Department Info (currently #5), then Women's Studies (currently #9), then WMST-L (currently #5). Meanwhile, here is the section that explains when to send mail to LISTSERV rather than to WMST-L, and includes information on how to unsubscribe: 2) "WHAT IS THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN LISTSERV@UMDD AND WMST-L@UMDD? HOW DO I TELL WHICH ADDRESS TO USE?" WMST-L@UMDD (or WMST-L@UMDD.UMD.EDU on Internet) should be used ONLY for messages that you wish to send to all WMST-L subscribers. Messages concerning your WMST-L subscription should be sent to LISTSERV@UMDD (or, on Internet, LISTSERV@UMDD.UMD.EDU). For example, send the following messages to LISTSERV, not WMST-L, when you wish to Subscribe to WMST-L SUB WMST-L Your Name ---> Cancel your subscription: UNSUB WMST-L [don't give name] Stop receiving mail temporarily: SET WMST-L NOMAIL [For digest, see Start receiving mail again: SET WMST-L MAIL info below] See who is subscribed to WMST-L: REVIEW WMST-L NOTE: If you subscribed under a Bitnet address and sent your subscription request to LISTSERV's Bitnet address (LISTSERV@UMDD), you must send ALL subsequent mail to the list's Bitnet address. Similarly, if you subscribed under an Internet address and sent your subscription request to LISTSERV's Internet address (LISTSERV@UMDD.UMD.EDU), you must send ALL subsequent mail to the list's Internet address. If you try to set your subscription to NOMAIL or you try to signoff and are told you don't have a subscription, chances are you are sending your request to the wrong address for LISTSERV. Simply try the other address. (See also section 4) Also, none of the above applies to the WMST-L digest. To stop the digest, send the following command to LISTSERV: AFD DEL WMST-L PACKAGE . To start the digest again, the command to LISTSERV is AFD ADD WMST-L PACKAGE . If you wish to unsubscribe AND stop the digest, send listserv a two-line message: UNSUB WMST-L on one line, AFD DEL WMST-L package on the other. See section 6 for more information about the digest. For more extensive information about LISTSERV commands, send LISTSERV the following two-word message: INFO GENINTRO. You'll receive a file entitled LISTSERV.MEMO. (See section 11 for how to retrieve files sent to you in Netdata format.) If you have a question about your subscription that you want a human being to read, do not send it to either WMST-L or LISTSERV. Instead, send it to the list owner, Joan Korenman [KORENMAN@UMBC (Bitnet) or KORENMAN@UMBC2.UMBC.EDU (Internet)]. Joan Korenman Internet: korenman@umbc2.umbc.edu Bitnet: korenman@umbc ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 10:31:52 -0400 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List Comments: Resent-From: CARMEN POULIN Comments: Originally-From: linton@unb.ca (Murray J. Linton) From: CARMEN POULIN Subject: Job ad in Fam.viol. research --------------------------- Original Message --------------------------- DIRECTOR The Muriel McQueen Fergusson Centre for Family Violence Research The University of New Brunswick in Fredericton, New Brunswick, Canada, invites applications for the position of Director of the Muriel McQueen Fergusson Centre for Family Violence Research. This will be a tenure stream appointment in the department of the applicant's specialization and carries a half teaching load. Rank is open. The successful applicant will be expected to serve as Director for a three year term, renewable upon mutual agreement. Qualifications include a doctoral degree in a social science (or related area), a strong research record, and interest in issues related to family violence or a related area, and experience working with community organizations. Experience in conducting multidisciplinary collaborative research would be an asset. Familiarity with Canadian society and its institutions would also be an asset. The mandate of the Centre is to co-ordinate research and educational programs aimed at reducing and ultimately eliminating family violence. All research is collaborative, between individuals from community organizations, government, and universities. Salary will be in accordance with the Collective Agreement depending on the candidate's qualifications. The University of New Brunswick is committed to the principle of employment equity. Review of applications will begin on February 1, 1995 and continue until the position is filled. Interested individuals should submit a curriculum vitae, recent publications, and three letters of reference to: Dr. Peter Kent, Dean of Arts University of New Brunswick, Fredericton, New Brunswick E3B 5A3 Canada FAX: (506) 453-5102 ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 09:37:40 -0400 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: David Merchant Subject: NEW: POS302-L - Race/Ethnicity Book Review List (fwd) Thought this might interest some of ya'll Ta-Ta For Now, David @::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: Merchant@utkvx.utk.edu University of Tennessee Celebrate DIversIty School of Information Science @::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Wed, 02 Nov 1994 08:41:25 -0400 From: William C. Robinson > > POS302-L on listserv@ilstu.edu > > POS302-L is a discussion list constructed for the Race, Ethnicity and > Social Inequality seminar to be held for the second time this Spring > (1995) at Illinois State University. Subscription to the list is > open to all faculty and students at any University or College. > > The discussion on the list consists of book reviews and commentaries > on book reviews submitted by the subscribers. Subscribers will > receive a "welcome" message indicating a schedule for each of the > twenty-seven books on the reading list. Reviews of other related > books are also welcome. > > To subscribe to POS302-L send a message to listserv@ilstu.edu > with the following command in the body: > > SUBSCRIBE POS302-L Your Name > > Note: listserv@ilstu.edu identifies itself as UNIX ListServer 6.0 > and is not an L-Soft LISTSERV of the same name. > > All the previous POS302-L reviews are archived on the > gopher under: > > /Information about Colleges and Departments > /Department of Political Science/COURSES/POS302-L. > > (or Path=1/depts/polisci/COURSES/POS302) > > The new books on the list for the Spring 1995 semester are: > * Thomas Sowell, RACE AND CULTURE: A WORLD > * James Crawford, HOLD YOUR TONGUE > * Ruth Sidel, BATTLING BIAS > * Dana Takagi, THE RETREAT FROM RACE > * Stephen CORNELL, THE RETURN OF THE NATIVE > * Vine Deloria and Clifford M. Lytle, THE NATIONS WITHIN > * Nathan McCall, MAKES ME WANNA HOLLER > * Ellis Cose, THE RAGE OF A PRIVILEGED CLASS > * Mitchell Duneier, SLIM'S TABLE > * Ruth Frankenberg, WHITE WOMEN, RACE MATTERS > * Douglas S. Massey and Nancy Denton, AMERICAN APARTHEID > * Robert D. Bullard, ed., UNEQUAL PROTECTION > * Jared Taylor, PAVED WITH GOOD INTENTIONS > * R. Feagin and Melvin P. Sikes, LIVING WITH RACISM > > Owner: Gary Klass gmklass@ilstu.edu > Associate Professor (309) 438-7852 > 4600 Political Science (fax) 438-5310 > Illinois State University > Normal, Illinois 61790-4600 > DISCLAIMER: NEW-LIST announcements are edited from information > provided by the original submitter. We do NOT verify the technical > accuracy nor any claims made in the announcements nor do we > necessarily agree with them. We do not warranty or guarantee any > services which might be announced - use at your own risk. For more > information send e-mail to LISTSERV@VM1.NoDak.EDU with the command > GET NEW-LIST README in the body. mgh ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 09:56:43 -0500 Reply-To: ae743@freenet.carleton.ca Sender: Women's Studies List From: Jacqueline Hunt Subject: SEARCHING THE WMST-L DATABASE I have recently heeded the advice to use the database search facilities of LISTSERV and obtained the LISTDB MEMO file. While it certainly tries to be kind to tyros, like most computer documents, it assumes knowledge that most arts academics don't have. Over the last few days, and with the help of a computer-pro friend, I have mastered the basics and am suitably impressed with what the author of one Internet book calls the most underused facility of LISTSERV. I have also realized what a time-saver it could be for people posting requests. Just recently, someone asked for titles about sisters, and I discovered from the archives that in May 1994 a compiled list of such stories had been posted. On the basis of my experience including receipt of ascerbic messages from LISTSERV about my errors in procedure, I am composing a simplified, 'How to get started-Dummy's Guide-to Searching-WMST- L', with exact templates to use for ordering past postings from the archives. I would be happy to e-mail this to any WMST-L participant, or if enough people are interested, I could post it to the list. This is certainly only intended as a duffer's 'quick start' to give people the courage to start using the search facility and then move on to the official excellent document. Jacquie Hunt ae743@freenet.carleton.ca ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 08:58:58 -0600 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Miriam Harris Subject: Re: Men and feminism In-Reply-To: <199411020128.UAA18789@holmes.umd.edu> How about: Men in Feminism. Alice Jardine and Paul Smith, eds. Routledge, 1989. Miriam Harris mharris@utdallas.edu On Tue, 1 Nov 1994, Lynne Alice wrote: > Can anyone suggest three well-articulated books (or readings) on the > relationship of men and/in feminism ... for a first year course. > > Lynne Alice > ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 09:34:36 EST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Kirsten Lindquist Organization: Purdue U. Political Science Dept. Subject: Re: feminist Fatale Thank you to everyone who sent along information/advice. As usual, this list is always so helpful and informative!!! Kirsten Lindquist ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 09:29:02 LCL Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Ruth Ginzberg Organization: Philosophy Dept., Wesleyan University Subject: "Safe" -- from what? I think this discussion of "safe space" is very important. One needs to ask, "safe -- from what?" There are things from which I think *every* classroom ought to constitute safe space -- those including at least: safety from physical assault, abuse, threat or harrassment; safety from sexual assault, abuse, threat or harrassment; safety from verbal assault, abuse, threat or harrassment; safety from political and economic persecution, retaliation or revenge for expressing one's beliefs, feelings and ideas; safety from teachers', parents', or administrators' abuse of power; safety from environmental health hazards; safety from acts of war and terrorism; etc. On the other hand -- I believe sometimes people, including students, need some kinds of safety that professional educators cannot and probably should not endeavor to provide in an academic classroom. For example, many people at some time in their lives need a "safe space" in which to emotionally "fall apart" -- in order to begin some process of recovery or healing or rebuilding. I think this kind of safe space needs to be provided by therapists and/or others who know more about facilitating such healing, not by teachers in academic classrooms. Many women need a "safe space" at some time in their lives in which they can be assured that ex-boyfriends or ex-husbands or ex-lovers will not know where they are or what they are saying, thinking or discussing. I think this sort of security cannot be provided in an ordinary classroom setting. Many people need a "safe space" in which they can tentatively explore previously unembraced identities, for example gay or lesbian identities, Jewish identities, etc. I think that teachers should be VERY CAREFUL about encouraging the use of the classroom for such purposes -- because of confidentiality issues. Many people might need a "safe space" in which to explore and/or come to terms with previous life-trauma, such as rape, war, abuse, torture, imprisonment and other experiences of violence. I think that the academic classroom is not equipped to provide such a space for those who need it. And then there are other issues as well. I think that classrooms and all the people in them must be *very* clear about the differences between intellectual challenge with respect to ideas, and personal attacks against the holders of ideas. All too often I see people wrongly equating 2 different kinds of things, both with academically disastrous results. One is when people erroneously equate emotional safety or caring with uncritical acceptance of absolutely everything they might think or say. Even the mildest question about why they might believe a certain view is experienced as a "personal attack". I think that's not good; we must not be that delicate and fragile that we cannot hear and think about legitimate questions posed with respect to our beliefs and ideas. The second is when people erroneously see no difference between attacking a person's *integrity* ("Why you unreasonable, ignorant jerk!") and legitimately challenging that person's *beliefs* ("How is it that you believe when <....evidence or reasoning to the contrary> would seem to indicate rather than ?") I also think this is related to a massive amount of confusion about the difference between feelings and beliefs. People confuse these in colloquial speech all the time ("I feel that so-and-so is the better candidate for the job.") Psychologists have urged us to listen to, and not to argue with, one another's *feelings* -- which is a good idea. But feelings not-to-be-argued-with are things like "I feel sad"; "I feel angry"; "I feel delighted"; "I feel underappreciated"; "I feel sick to my stomach"; "I feel embarrassed"; "I feel unsafe"; *NOT* "I feel that so-and-so is the best candidate" or "I feel that women belong in the home" or "I feel that this painting is pornographic" (which are *beliefs*, not *feelings* and which *should* be able to be challenged and discussed, pro and con, in a classroom). Well, once again, sorry this got so long, and thank you for reading this far; I'll quit here. ----------- Ruth Ginzberg (rginzberg@eagle.wesleyan.edu) ------------ ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 10:28:14 EST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Gary Daily Subject: Re: Men and feminism > Can anyone suggest three well-articulated books (or readings) on the > relationship of men and/in feminism ... for a first year course. > > Lynne Alice Lynne, You might look at Kimmel and Mosmiller (ed.)., _Against the Tide: Pro-Feminist Men in the United States, 1776-1990--A Ducumentary History_. Good luck with the course. gary daily hidaily@ruby.indstate.edu ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 09:59:48 -0600 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Felicia Bender Subject: Re: Men and feminism >Can anyone suggest three well-articulated books (or readings) on the >relationship of men and/in feminism ... for a first year course. > >Lynne Alice bell hooks' _Feminist Theory: from margin to center_ is a great book, but if you want to pull just men/women out of it, there is a chapter titled "Men: Comrades in Struggle" which deals with these issues specifically, although the entire book is inclusive. Good luck! Felicia Bender c391738@showme.missouri.edu ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 12:02:46 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Katy Milligan Subject: CFPs on upenn gopher I have been collecting all of the calls for papers from this listserve that could be relevant to literature scholars in a gopher site at the University of Pennsylvania. The URL is below. This address will give you a directory for a variety of English-related CFPs - the WMST-L ones are under gender-studies. The coordinator of this gopher site is Lawrence Warner; he can be contacted at lwarner@dept.english.upenn.edu. Hope you will find it useful - I certainly have. Katy Milligan >It would be great if you could advertise our gopher CFP on the e-lists >you subscribe to: we'd love the numbers to rack up (makes our gopher look >useful) and I'm sure the other subscribers would appreciate knowing that >they don't have to save all these announcements on their own. If you're >willing, then just say that the URL is: > >gopher://dept.english.upenn.edu/11/Announce/CFP > >Maybe a note explaining that the format of the specific entries >is: < title/subject of conference (deadline for submissions; date of event) > >>would be helpful. --------------- Katherine J. Milligan 2118 Walnut Street #2M Philadelphia, PA 19103-4808 (215)587-9149 kmilli@ccat.sas.upenn.edu ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 11:46:58 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Beth A Mcdermott Subject: Wives of Vietnam Veterans Is there any research out there about the lives and experiences of the wives of veterans of the Vietnam War? A teaching assistant for a course on the Vietnam Era is looking to broaden the scope of the course from political history to more of the social effects on the homefront and thought this might be of interest to the students. Please reply privately to bethm@christa.unh.edu Thanks Beth McDermott bethm@christa.unh.edu ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 11:08:01 EST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: STRETCH OR DROWN/ EVOLVE OR DIE Subject: Re: Men and feminism I don't really recommend Men in Feminism for an introductory course to raise the issue of male feminism. It's a very theoretical book for one thing and I fear students might find its debates too arcane. I could be misremembering. In addition, I'm not wildly fond of the book myself. I found the debate it presented at times a bit self-indulgent on both sides. I can't quite put my finger on what bothered me about the debate, but perhaps my problem stems from my sense that the question of whether men should be feminists is really kind of a non-question. Of course they should be if they want to be, so why debate it. Instead more fruitful discoveries might come from asking questions about what this thing we call masculinity is. How is masculinity constructed in our culture, in other cultures? What effects does this construction have on both men and women? For intro courses, I use Michael Kimmel and Michael Messner's anthology Men's Lives which has enough essays in it that you can pick and choose what you like. ,,, (o o) +-------------------------------oOOo-(_)-oOOo--------------------------------+ | Laurie Finke, Women's and Gender Studies, Kenyon College | | Gambier, OH 43022 phone: 614-427-5276 | | home: 614-427-3428, P.O. Box 731 mail: FinkeL@Kenyon.Edu | +----------------------------------------------------------------------------+ () () ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 09:13:34 -0800 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Alexander Freund Subject: Re: Men and feminism In-Reply-To: <199411020230.SAA03038@whistler.sfu.ca> from "Lynne Alice" at Nov 2, 94 02:35:49 pm Lynne, I can highly recommend John Stoltenberg's _Refusing to be a man_. AUTHOR: Stoltenberg, John. TITLE: Refusing to be a man : essays on sex and justice / John Stoltenberg. IMPRINT: Portland, Or. : Breitenbush Books, 1989. PHYSICAL DESCRIPTION: 225 p. NOTE: CALL NUMBER: HQ 28 S86 1989 * Includes index. SUBJECT: Men -- United States -- Sexual behavior. * Masculinity (Psychology) * Sex role -- United States. * Machismo -- United States. * Sexism -- United States. * Women -- United States -- Crimes against. CONTROL NO.: LCCN: 89000607 ISN: ISBN: 0932576737 : SOURCE NUMBER: 89000 Stoltenberg's essays are (as much as I remember) mainly educational lectures. They are easy to read and understand, yet their message is conveyed in a thought-provoking (and to some men perhaps troubling) way. I have also heard only good stuff about Michael Kaufmann's _Cracking the Armour - Power and Pain in Men's Lives (Penguin Books, 1993, available as paperback). Best wishes Alexander Freund Dept. of History Simon Fraser University Burnaby, B. C. Canada V5A 1S6 e-mail: freund@sfu.ca ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 10:03:34 -0800 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: ME Subject: Joanna Russ reference Several years ago I saw a casual reference to an article by Joanna Russ that was supposed to be about women who write Star Trek fanzines. I have never been able to locate a citation. Does anyone know if this article actually exists? Do you have a full citation, or a copy you can send me? I would, of course, pay any expenses. Please reply privately. Mary Eichbauer gg-mee@ix.netcom.com ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 13:01:05 -0600 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: greta gaard Subject: Re: Men and feminism In-Reply-To: <199411021503.JAA13664@ub.d.umn.edu> I found the Men in Feminism text to be okay, but prefer Against The Tide: Pro-Feminist Men in the United States, 1776-1990, edited by Michael S. Kimmel and Thomas E. Mosmiller (Beacon, 1992). On Wed, 2 Nov 1994, Miriam Harris wrote: > How about: Men in Feminism. Alice Jardine and Paul Smith, > eds. Routledge, 1989. > Miriam Harris > mharris@utdallas.edu > > > On Tue, 1 Nov 1994, Lynne Alice wrote: > > > Can anyone suggest three well-articulated books (or readings) on the > > relationship of men and/in feminism ... for a first year course. > > > > Lynne Alice > > > ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 12:23:51 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: John Kellermeier Organization: SUNY at Plattsburgh, New York, USA Subject: Re: Men and feminism >Can anyone suggest three well-articulated books (or readings) on the >relationship of men and/in feminism ... for a first year course. > >Lynne Alice In my Intro to Women's Studies class I currently do a unit on men, masculinity and feminism. Here are the articles I use Clatterbaugh, K., Masculinist Perspectives, _Changing_Men_, Winter/ Spring 1989. This article gives a variety of perspectives on masculinity (conservative, anti-sexist, men's rights, new age, socialist) and the relationship of each view point to feminism. Clatterbaugh has also published a book on this topic, _Contemporary_Perspectives_on_ _Masculinity_. Boulder, CO: Westview. 1990. Stoltenberg, J., The Profeminist Men's Movement: New Connections, New Directions, _Changing_Men_, Winter/Spring 1989. I would also recommend anything written by Stoltenberg. Much of his writings have been collected in this book, _Refusing_to_Be_a_Man_, New York: Penguin/ Meridian, 1989. A variety of articles from the book _New_Men,_New Minds_ edited by Franklin Abbott, (published by Crossing Press). The specific articles I use are Pleck, J., Healing the Wounded Father Fremont-Smith, K., Some Scars Don't Show Messner, M., Ah, Ya Throw Like a Girl Sabo, D., Pigskin, Patriarchy and Pain Jesse, C.J., Oh, My Loving Brother Julty, S., Men and Their Health: A Strained Alliance Thompson, C., "A New Vision of Masculinity" I would most recommend the last article by Cooper Thompson. Some of these articles, including Cooper Thompson's, will be reprinted in the new edition of Paula Rothenberg's _Race,_Class_&_Gender_in_the _United_States_. Lastly, another source of good writings from the beginnings of the profeminist men's movement is _A_Book_of_Readings_for_Men_against_Sexism_. Albion, CA: Times Change Press, 1977. John Kellermeier splava.cc.plattsburgh.edu ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 15:44:43 EST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: lin collette Subject: thanks for the tips Thanks to everyone who responded to my query re feminist bookstores in Albu- querque New Mexico. Never let it be said that WMST-L'ers don't know where the good stuff is! I got lots of responses: For the record, the bookstore is called Full Circle. There were far too many replies to respond to individ- ually, so I'm thanking you all via WMST-L. THANK YOU! lin collette bi599128@brownvm.brown.edu ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 16:24:32 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Ann Travers Subject: Text/book suggestions for women online Has anyone run into any texts/trade books that deal specifically with women online? Ellen Balka's paper is a good jumping off point and I was hoping there might be a book(s) devoted to this topic. I checked at the Yale Univ. Co-op and no one had heard of anything specifically on the subject. Please respond privately to: Agtravers@AOL.COM Thanks. Ann ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 16:37:01 -0500 Reply-To: Lisa Jadwin Sender: Women's Studies List From: Lisa Jadwin Subject: compiled suggs. for "men & women in contemp. lit" course In-Reply-To: <199411021944.OAA08874@holmes.umd.edu> Here are the responses, from WMST and my colleagues here, to my query about works of "literature" (any genre) that address gender from both male and female perspectives. Lisa Jadwin jadwin@sjfc.edu Nothing specific at this point, but I can tell you that a lot of my Language and Gender students have a lot to say about Harlequin type romances. They enjoy talking about the relationship that are created and how they mirror/create/challenge stereotypes. Easy reading, too. I'll ask THEM for suggestions on Wednesday. Laurel Black black@sjfc.edu some helpful men: james baldwin's essays in THE PRICE OF THE TICKET (1985). wendell berry's THE HIDDEN WOUND 1989: collection of autobiographica essays on the effects of racism on berry growing up as a white man. both authors are passionate and moving about their experiences of racism from dominated and dominant perspectives. also, each can be excerpted to look at how gender is submerged in racism-as-a-man's-thing even among well-intentioned men. debian marty dmarty@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu Lisa, I'll be teaching a course similar to yours in the spring. One text that I have found that has taught well to non-English majors is Michael Ondaatje's _In the Skin of a Lion_. People have also suggested David Joranorowicz (sp?) to me. Allison Fraiberg afraibe@calstatela.edu The first possibility that comes to mind is Anne Tyler's "Dinner at the Homesick Restaurant" (1981 or '82), for its fractured family and its "anti-heroic" male protagonist, Ezra. Linda has taught this more often than I have, but students usually take to it very well. My experience with Saul Bellow's "Mr. Sammler's Planet" this semester in 389 makes me think it would be interesting in a "Men and Women" context. It has a good deal of sex-role posturing in it, and makes concern with at least some of the sexual iconography of the culture explicit. Bellow's allusiveness may create problems with the (implied) level of discourse, but that bothered my students less than I feared it would. The book does have a misogynistic tinge. (Some might say more than a tinge, but I think the text itself makes it pretty easy to identify the male defensiveness that gives rise to it, and so to mark it as characterization, not recommendation.) Hurston's "Their Eyes . . ." is, of course, a good candidate, but if we're not careful we'll soon be teaching that one in more than half our classes. Morrison's "Beloved" would put the identity and role issues in a context of Black characters who were put in a position to doubt and to contest their rights to the designation "men" or "women." But that's another fairly tough text. You could always drop back to "Bluest Eye." Ntozake Shange's "For Colored Girls . . ." confronts Black female identity very accessibly; it's also a quick read. I think "The Great Gatsby" is a classic treatment of American gender and identity myths, but maybe that's either too old or too hackneyed for your purposes. In poetry, I'd suggest Adrienne Rich, maybe "Time's Power" (1988) for a base text, supplemented with xeroxes of perhaps a half dozen other poems. Levertov has lots of good poems for the topic but collecting them is the problem. For poetry dealing with men's identity maybe Robert Lowell's "Life Studies." I wonder what would happen if you brought Ginsberg's "Howl" into the men/women context. Bill Waddell waddell@sjfc.edu Boo! When I atught the course two years ago I used the following novels, films, and theoretical texts. Angela Carter, _Love_ & _The STrange Desire Machines of Dr. Hoffman_, both in conjunction with sections from _Remaking Love_, by Ehrenreich et. al. These novels were the toughest of the bunch, but since 40 students enrolled at first, I'm glad we read these novels first since they scared of the slackers. I used the novels to focus on discourses about the sexual revolution: whose revolution, namely. Margaret Atwood, _Lady Oracle_, in conjunction with chapters from Radway's _Reading the Romance_. Students really enjoyed this novel, and felt empowered by reading it, for it provided some with a vocabulary to think about issues that they had previously acknowledged but had not been able to articulate. Tim O'Brian, _Going After Cacciato_. I's teach this again in a heartbeat, because it allows you to focus on how and why people believe stories about male heroism, despite the clearly fictitious nature of the stories. The students were intrigued and challenged by the novel's surreal style, but that style is an integral aspect of the storytelling process examined. Martin Scorcese, _Taxi Driver_. A critical look at abject heroism and violence that is difficult to teach because of its easily fetishizable qualities: DeNerio as Travis Bickle, for example. Oliver Stone, _Platoon_. I played this film's simplistic representation of heroism off of Kubrick's _Full Metal Jacket_. John Irving, _The World According to Garp_. A long but easy read that students enjoyed. And because some of them were engaged by the novel, it was easy to challenge the novel because they had a good grasp og its plot. I taught this along with a piece that Irving published in the NYTBook Review several years ago about pornography and censhorship. John Updike, _The Witches of Eastwick_. I despise this book, yet felt that i needed to teach it to focus on conservative reactions to feminism. Bobbie Ann Mason, _In Country_. A fitting culmination to the class, since the novel focused on the cultural interdependance of sexuality and heroism, but narrated from a woman's perspective. Student's talked about this book till they were blue in the face. John Palattella palattella@sjfc.edu Lisa, I have taught a few courses dealing with gender, race, class and sexuality. Male authors have been hard to locate, in my own experience, but here's some ideas: Hemingway (stories from IN OUR TIME)--not obviously "sympathetic," but certainly responding to changes in gender, the New Woman, redefinitions of masculinity. I teach these stories with some by William Carlos Williams (THE FARMER'S DAUGHTERS), esp "The Buffaloes" and "Descendent of Kings." Both have lots of ambivalences and heterocentricism, but interesting. Richard Wright's story, "Man of All Work," about a cross-drssing fiasco, raises some interesting discussion (from EIGHT MEN). I like George Herriman's KRAZY KAT cartoons, esp. panels which stress Krazy's ambivalent gender. Have fun with your course. Lorna Smedman (ljs@cunyvms1.gc.cuny.edu) Lisa, I don't teach, just a grad student at this point, but stumbled across a wonderful novel that I have recommended to a friend who is teaching a course that sounds similar to the one you describe. He read it and plans to use it in the spring, maybe you will like it too. _A Yellow Raft on Blue Water_ Michael Dorris Sarah Perry i know this isn't literature, but it seems related somehow to me since it's by a man about perceptions of women in the arts...just a thought. Edwin Mullins, The Painted Witch, Female Body:Male Art, How sestern artists have viewed the sexuality of women. London, 1985 Jan Marquardt Art Department Eastern Illinois University ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 14:51:15 PDT Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Kimberly Jensen Organization: Western Oregon State College Subject: Ruth Law Caryn Neumann asks for information on Ruth Law Oliver, pioneer woman aviator in the US. I deal with Law in my dissertation (1992, University of Iowa, directed by Linda Kerber) "Minerva on the Field of Mars: American Women, Citizenship, and Military Service in the First World War." Law petitioned for a place in the military as a pilot and was rejected. She served as a publicity stunt flier for the war effort and was suspected of being a spy. Please feel free to contact me personally if I can answer any questions. Kimberly Jensen History and Gender Studies Western Oregon State College jenseki@fsa.wosc.osshe.edu ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 15:04:18 PDT Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Kimberly Jensen Organization: Western Oregon State College Subject: Ehrenreich Contact Information Needed We are interested in contacting Barbara Ehrenreich. If you have contact information for her (email, telephone or address) would you please send it PRIVATELY to jenseki@fsa.wosc.osshe.edu. Thanks for your help. Please respond privately. Kimberly Jensen History and Gender Studies Western Oregon State College jenseki@fsa.wosc.osshe.edu ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 11:31:37 +1200 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Lynne Alice Subject: Men and feminism Thanks everyone for your responses to my request for books on men and/in feminism for a first course course. Here's the compilation of responses. (Incidentally I find these WMST-L compilations quite useful additions to student reading lists - it stimulates them to seek out and learn to use the Net). themselves. Cheers, Lynne Alice L.C.Alice@massey.ac.nz _______Men and/in Feminism____ On Tue, 1 Nov 1994, Lynne Alice wrote: Can anyone suggest three well-articulated books (or readings) on the relationship of men and/in feminism ... for a first year course. Lynne Alice Lynne, You might look at Kimmel and Mosmiller (ed.)., _Against the Tide: Pro-Feminist Men in the United States, 1776-1990--A Documentary History_. Good luck with the course. gary daily hidaily@ruby.indstate.edu ______________________________ Lynne, I've heard that John Stoltenberg's _Learning to Be a Man_ is good (he's a pro-feminist). Also, what about _Women Respond to the Men's Movement_ (I think that's the title... Michelle mgolden@unix.cc.emory.edu PS Can't think of a third, sorry. ______________________________ bell hooks' _Feminist Theory: from margin to center_ is a great book, but if you want to pull just men/women out of it, there is a chapter titled "Men: Comrades in Struggle" which deals with these issues specifically, although the entire book is inclusive. Good luck! Felicia Bender c391738@showme.missouri.edu ______________________________ How about: Men in Feminism. Alice Jardine and Paul Smith, eds. Routledge, 1989. Miriam Harris mharris@utdallas.edu _____________________________ In my Intro to Women's Studies class I currently do a unit on men, masculinity and feminism. Here are the articles I use Clatterbaugh, K., Masculinist Perspectives, _Changing_Men_, Winter/ Spring 1989. This article gives a variety of perspectives on masculinity (conservative, anti-sexist, men's rights, new age, socialist) and the relationship of each view point to feminism. Clatterbaugh has also published a book on this topic, _Contemporary_Perspectives_on_ _Masculinity_. Boulder, CO: Westview. 1990. Stoltenberg, J., The Profeminist Men's Movement: New Connections, New Directions, _Changing_Men_, Winter/Spring 1989. I would also recommend anything written by Stoltenberg. Much of his writings have been collected in this book, _Refusing_to_Be_a_Man_, New York: Penguin/ Meridian, 1989. A variety of articles from the book _New_Men,_New Minds_ edited by Franklin Abbott, (published by Crossing Press). The specific articles I use are Pleck, J., Healing the Wounded Father Fremont-Smith, K., Some Scars Don't Show Messner, M., Ah, Ya Throw Like a Girl Sabo, D., Pigskin, Patriarchy and Pain Jesse, C.J., Oh, My Loving Brother Julty, S., Men and Their Health: A Strained Alliance Thompson, C., "A New Vision of Masculinity" I would most recommend the last article by Cooper Thompson. Some of these articles, including Cooper Thompson's, will be reprinted in the new edition of Paula Rothenberg's _Race,_Class_&_Gender_in_the _United_States_. Lastly, another source of good writings from the beginnings of the profeminist men's movement is _A_Book_of_Readings_for_Men_against_Sexism_. Albion, CA: Times Change Press, 1977. John Kellermeier splava.cc.plattsburgh.edu _____________________________ Alice, I always recommend Men's Lives, an anthology edited byMichael Kimmell and Michael Messner. It's largely American, but it has a lot of material in it. On the down side it's rather expensive around $30. It's published by MacMillan. I also quite like the work of Bob Connell whose Australian. ,,, (o o) +-------------------------------oOOo-(_)-oOOo------------------------------- -+ | Laurie Finke, Women's and Gender Studies, Kenyon College | | Gambier, OH 43022 phone: 614-427-5276 | | home: 614-427-3428, P.O. Box 731 mail: FinkeL@Kenyon.Edu | +----------------------------------------------------------------------------+ () () A very good book that I use is Beyond Patriarchy: Essays by Men on Pleasure, Power and Change, edited by Michael Kaufman, Oxford University Press. Two articles of note are "The Construction of Masculinity and the Triad of Men's Violence" by Michael Kaufman and "Sports and Masculinity" by Bruce Kidd, both in the above mentioned book Good luck. DEVINE@aim1.bus.ryerson.ca ____________________________ Hello Lynne, Most of my reading is at the graduate level and largely academic. I am assuming that by saying "a first year course," you are talking about an undergrad course. At the undergrad level, you might consider Sam Keen's book, _Fire_in_the_Belly_. Keen is a feminist. The book does look at men in relation to women, which may not be what you are looking for. This book is easily understood. If you wish to challenge your students more, I would consider Bell Hooks, and also writers of theory that while developed in feminist contexts have far reaching philosophical value. In this I would include Flax, Gilligan, Mohanty, Trinh Min-Ha, etc. The thought in this approach is to give exposure to new ontologies and concepts of knowlege. Gilligan, though trapped in class-bias, does good work on the development of morality. Thoughts only, Steve H shartwel@carbon.denver.colorado.edu _______________________________ Dear Lynne, You might consider some combination of the following: bell hooks, "Men: Comrades in Struggle," in FROM MARGIN TO CENTER. A more personal, and I think powerful, reading from hooks is her "Challenging Patriarchy means Challenging Men to Change," in ANGRY WOMEN (Re/Search, 1991). Toril Moi, "Men against Patriarchy," in GENDER AND THEORY, Linda Kauffman, ed., (Oxford: Basil Blackwell, 1989) Barbara Kingsolver, "Cabbages and Kings," in WOMEN RESPOND TO THE MEN'S MOVEMENT, Kay Leigh Hagan, ed. (San Francisco: Pandora, 1992) Sandra Harding, "Reinventing Ourselves as Other: More New Agents of History and Knowledge," in AMERICAN FEMINIST THOUGHT AT CENTURY'S END, Linda Kauffman, ed. (Cambridge, MA: Blackwell, 1993) Hope that's of help. David Kahane Department of Philosophy McGill University ______________________ Try *Men in Feminism* Alice Jardine and Paul smith, eds. New York: Methuen, 1987. Has some good readings. Kathy ryder@chuma.cas.usf.edu ____________________________ I found the Men in Feminism text to be okay, but prefer Against The Tide: Pro-Feminist Men in the United States, 1776-1990, edited by Michael S. Kimmel and Thomas E. Mosmiller (Beacon, 1992). greta gaard ggaard@D.UMN.EDU ______________________________ ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 14:39:23 -0800 Reply-To: Joan Ariel Sender: Women's Studies List From: Joan Ariel Subject: Re: Text/book suggestions for women online In-Reply-To: <199411022126.QAA13080@holmes.umd.edu> I am sending this reply to the full list, because this book deserves broad distribution: Recommend: WOMEN, INFORMATION TECHNOLOGY, AND SCHOLARSHIP edited by H. Jeanie Taylor, Cheris Kramarae, and Maureen Ebben. 1993. 128 p. paperback, $10 + $2 shipping, IBSN # 1-882875-00-1. Order from: WITS, Center for Advanced Study, 912 West Illinois Street, Urbana, IL 61801. For more information, call (217) 333-6729. *************************************************** Joan Ariel Academic Coordinator, Women's Studies and Women's Studies Librarian University of California, Irvine jariel@uci.edu (714) 856-4970 *************************************************** On Wed, 2 Nov 1994, Ann Travers wrote: > Has anyone run into any texts/trade books that deal specifically with women > online? Ellen Balka's paper is a good jumping off point and I was hoping > there might be a book(s) devoted to this topic. I checked at the Yale Univ. > Co-op and no one had heard of anything specifically on the subject. > > Please respond privately to: Agtravers@AOL.COM > > Thanks. > Ann > ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 18:18:55 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Kathy Burdette Subject: inforM update The following directory has been added to inforM: Educational Resources/Academic Resources by Topic/Women's Studies Resources/Gender Issues/Sexual Harassment/Tailhook 91 (part 2) This directory is part 2 of the navy investigative report concerning allegations of sexual harassment and other misconduct at the Tailhook 91 convention. To access the inforM database, telnet or gopher to INFORM.UMD.EDU. (If you do not know how to telnet or gopher, contact a local computer wizard, or try typing "telnet inform.umd.edu" or "gopher inform.umd.edu" at the main prompt of your computer account). Hit return to set the default terminal type or type "?" for a list of choices. Use either your arrow keys or number keys to select -> 4. Educational Resources 2. Academic Resources by Topic 10. Women's Studies Resources 9. Gender Issues 6. Sexual Harassment 5. Tailhook 91 (part 2) The Gopher interface has a feature that allows users to send files to their e-mail accounts. After selecting a file, either scroll to the end of the file or type "q", then press "m". The system will then prompt you for your email address. The inforM system is also accessible by anonymous ftp. FTP to INFORM.UMD.EDU. Login as "anonymous", and use your mail address as a password. Choose the "inforM" directory by typing "cd inforM". The command "cd [directory name]" will change the directory. The commands "dir" or "ls" will display a list of files in that directory. Use the command "get [filename]" to download a file into your account. The FTP pathname for this directory is: inforM/Educational_Resources/AcademicResourcesByTopic/WomensStudies/ GenderIssues/SexualHarassment/Tailhook-91-part2 Your local Gopher System may be set up to automatically link to the Women's Studies Database. Check the "Other Systems" or "Other Gophers" directory or ask your system administrator for help. Even if you do not have real Internet access, it is still possible to get files from inforM. If you are interested in this option, please email me and I will forward a file written by Mark Whitis that explains how to do this. Please remember that the system is case sensitive. Anything that appears in quotes must be typed exactly as it is here. If you have any questions or comments, please feel free to contact me. +=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+= Kathy Burdette inforM, Room 4343 Coordinator, Women's Studies Database Computer Science Center burdette@inform.umd.edu University of Maryland (301) 405-2939 College Park, Maryland 20742 =+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+ ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 20:34:24 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: DAPHNE PATAI Subject: "Safe space" In-Reply-To: <199411021324.IAA27180@holmes.umd.edu> from "Joan D. Mandle" at Nov 2, 94 08:30:01 am I agree entirely with Beverly's and Joan's reservations about the concept of a "safe space" as anything other than the normal, civil classroom that all people ought to be able to support. Women all over the world have struggled (some are still struggling) for access to higher education. The idea that women students need a "safe space" beyond that which all students in a very general sense have a right to suggests to me that these students are being conceptualized as emotional cripples or fragile vessels. Such a view is likely to be far more damaging to young women than lively and, yes, even heated debate. This is a very unfortunate and, it seems, fairly recent development of feminism, and it does no honor to the women it claims to serve. ====================== Daphne.Patai@spanport.umass.edu ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 23:32:00 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Arnie Kahn Subject: Re: "Safe space" Wonderful discussion of "safe space." I generally agree with Ruth, Daphne, Joan, and others who've suggested that the academic classroom is not the place for limiting voices or doing therapy. And I agree that safe from physical or psychological abuse is different from safe to express. Yet, in Women's Studies classes we often profess that the personal is political. How can we draw the line between safety to express the personal and therapy? When students connect their personal experiences with politics the result is sometimes tears or anger or rage or feelings of helplessness, which come close to if not require some kind of theraputic intervention. I don't know how to deal with this, but it seems to happen every time I teach psychology of women. At any rate (it's late and I'm rambling) I think we might need to differentiate "safe from hostile ideas" from "safe to express one's own feelings." I think the former safety dangerous and the latter safety necessary in most WS courses. Arnie Kahn fac_askahn@vax1.acs.jmu.edu fac_askahn@jmuvax ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Nov 1994 12:03:22 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Patrice McDermott Subject: Re: Creating Safe Space for Women in Classrooms In-Reply-To: <199411021324.IAA13348@franklin.seas.gwu.edu> On Wed, 2 Nov 1994, Joan D. Mandle wrote: > Cheryl writes that we need to create "safe space in classrooms for women which > is similar to that safe space we create in a counseling relationship or a > women's shelter." I feel that comparing the goals of a classroom to a > therapeutic relationship is extremely dangerous, for it eliminates the > possibility of serious disagreement - even conflict - about ideas which I > believe to be necessary for real learning to go on. A classroom should be > "safe space" for all students but only in the sense that they are free there > to exchange ideas, explore differing points of view, and to open themselves > up to challenges to their own points of view. > Joan D. Mandle > jdmandle@center.colgate.edu I agree with Joan. I am currently teaching a course on the politics of race, gender & class -- with a quite diverse group of students -- and when I mentioned to a student that I felt some unease & tension among the students about topics and threads of the conversation, she said "But this class is supposed to make us uncomfortable" meaning it was supposed to challenge easy assumptions and conventional insights. Which, to me, is precisely what critically-oriented education is supposed to do -- and what feminism is meant to do. Patrice McDermott patricem@cap.gwu.edu ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 05:48:02 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Amy Goodle Subject: Problems with LesAc (cross posted to multiple lists) * cross posted to: WMST-L, QSTUDY-L, politidykes, qn, soc.feminism, Sappho, UCLGBA, FEMINIST, and GLB-News. (11/3/94) On October 24 I posted a note about the mailing list "LesAc," which I set up for lesbian graduate students (and faculty), letting you know that I was taking new subscribers. The list has since grown from 180 subscribers to 420, but not without some complications. Unfortunately, my decision to take new subscribers couldn't have come at a worse time, since America Online went through a major system upgrade at about the same time and ran into trouble with its internet gateway. As a result, quite a few subscribers, new and old, are not getting their mail, and I have no way of knowing whose mail is going through and whose isn't. >From what I understand, some people are getting their mail on a delayed basis, as much as five or six days AFTER I send it out. But others aren't getting anything, and I would like to propose a temporary solution. Until AOL works out the problems with its internet gateway, I can send LesAc mail to those who haven't been getting it from another "location." What I need to know is WHO out there hasn't gotten LesAc mail in over one week, and WHAT is the most recent LesAc mail you received. Profiles 91-100 went out on 11/2, so let me know if you got that. Please send this info. to: Amy_Goodloe@out.org. Also, if you saw the earlier notice re: new subscribers to LesAc, and posted it on another list, please also post this note on that list -- I'm trying to reach everyone who has subscribed to the list, which I obviously can't do by mailing to the list itself since so many of the addresses won't "go through." I very much appreciate your assistance with this, and I apologize that this post doesn't fit the guidelines of some of the lists to which I'm sending it -- but I feel like I don't have any other way to let people know what happened. Thank you! -- Amy Goodloe Ruby8fruit@aol.com LezScholar@aol.com Amy_Goodloe@out.org agoodloe@mercury.sfsu.edu ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 07:07:05 -0600 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Helen Thompson Subject: Irish women Is anyone out there working in the field of Irish women's studies? I'm feeling starved for company and would love to communicate/share resources with anyone interested in this field. I am primarily looking at Irish women writers (specifically Edna O'Brien) and their status in Irish society from the 1930s onwards. Please email me privately unless you think that the list would benefit from your message. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Helen Thompson hthompsn@whale.st.usm.edu Department of English (601) 266 5045 (office) SS Box 5037 (601) 264 6563 (home) Hattiesburg (601) 266 5757 (fax) MS 39401-5037 <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 08:54:18 EST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Jo Freeman Subject: Title VII article Several people requested copies of my article on "How Sex Got Into Title VII" i n response to my recent posting of my letter to Ms. on their perpetuation of th e mythical version. I don't have the resources to copy and mail to everyone. For those unable to get it from a library, it can be obtained via internet. Several of my articles, including that one, are archived: Gopher to INFORM.UMD .EDU and select Educational Resources//Academic Resources//Women's Studies Res ources//Government and Politics//Articles and Papers// then look for the title. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 09:22:06 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Theresa Kaminski Subject: DATELINE NBC A student of mine is working on a speech about breast cancer for another class of hers. She came to me yesterday to talk about a story she had seen the night before on NBC's Dateline. It was about a man, a lawyer, who claimed to be "pro-woman," who is arguing that there is a connection between breast cancer and abortion and who is launching a class-action law suit. I didn't see the program and would appreciate clarification from someone. The story did go on to show that the man's argument is not based on solid evidence. Who is this person and what are the studies he is using? Please respond privately. Theresa Kaminski tkaminsk@uwspmail.uwsp.edu ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 08:32:05 CST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Stephanie Riger Subject: beyond "safe space" I'd like to take the discussion of safe space in feminist classrooms a step further. I wholeheartedly agree with those who believe that the classroom should be a place where challenging, even antagonistic ideas are presented (and, of course, challenged themselves). THe question becomes how to handle conflict in the classroom in a way that does not squelch students' freedom of expression. For the past two years, our Women's Studies program has organized a monthly faculty discussion group on "gender, race, and classroom dynamics" and we talk about this often. Does anyone on this list have specific teaching strategies for dealing with conflict in the classroom, or issues likely to bring out conflict such as race, abortion, etc.? If so, I'd appreciate it if you would share them. Stephanie Riger Women's Studies Program (M/C 360) Univ. of Il. at Chicago 1022 Behavioral Sciences Building 1007 W. Harrison St. Chicago, Il. 60607-7137 Bitnet: u29322@UICVM Internet: Stephanie.Riger@uic.edu Fax: 312-413-4122 ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 10:43:23 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Katy Milligan Subject: contemp lit of transformation I'm beginning a project on physical transformation or metamorphosis in contemporary American literature and culture, especially (though not exclusively) in reference to gender and sexuality issues - sex changes of some sort seem to be the predominant form of transformation in the sources I've encountered so far. What is so striking about this topic is that while metamorphosis is *pervasive* in popular culture (science fiction, vampires, Disney movies, etc), it seems to be almost entirely absent from 'canonical' postmodern literature, the kind of cultural product generally awarded 'good' status by the academy. (There are exceptions, like the moment of physical transformation at the end of some of Morrison's novels, for example.) My question for this list is about further canonical sources on metamorphosis in contemporary literature - do they exist, or is this entirely a pop culture phenomenon? Please reply privately to kmilli@ccat.sas.upenn.edu. I'll be happy to post a summary if there's sufficient interest. Thank you in advance for your response. Katy Milligan --------------- Katherine J. Milligan 2118 Walnut Street #2M Philadelphia, PA 19103-4808 (215)587-9149 kmilli@ccat.sas.upenn.edu ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 09:47:01 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: DAPHNE PATAI Subject: Re: "Safe space" In-Reply-To: <199411030434.XAA23393@holmes.umd.edu> from "Arnie Kahn" at Nov 2, 94 11:32:00 pm Arnie, if only that minimalist definition "safe to express one's own feelings" were the general rule. But as many students in women's studies classes will tell you, they do NOT feel that sense of safety, because too often a few grandstanding "feminists" have set the tone and terms of debate and anyone who's not on their wavelength is made to feel they deserve banishment to the outer darkness. My own feeling is that less emphasis on the "personal" and more on intellectual growth is what an academic environment should be fostering. It's also the guess, I believe, that teachers need to take note of whatever's missing/suppressed from a *particular* intellectual setting. When there's no room for any sort of feminist perspective, it's that that needs to be introduced. When there's no room for anything BUT a feminist perspective, it's a bunch of other things that need to occur in the classroom. Feminists have not, as far as I can tell, on the whole done better than their forebears in striking a proper balance in the classroom. D. -- ====================== Daphne.Patai@spanport.umass.edu ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 09:55:02 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Cheryl Sattler Subject: Safe Space--A Clarification Not to belabor this point, but this was a literature request for a friend. I am not in a position to defend/explain/debate this issue, although it seems to have struck a nerve on this list. Has anyone read any work that addresses these issues so she can get a handle on the area of research? Thank you for your help. _________________ Cheryl Sattler, Ph.D. Florida State University FAX (904) 644-0643 PHONE (904) 644-1142 internet: sattler@bio.fsu.edu ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 10:11:37 LCL Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Ruth Ginzberg Organization: Philosophy Dept., Wesleyan University Subject: Re: "Safe space" >... teachers need to take note of whatever's missing/suppressed from a >*particular* intellectual setting. In many of my classes, I schedule a "Process Day" following each book/unit/etc. -- which is time set aside to ask the question, "How did our discussion of this last book/subject/unit go?" This is explicitly time to note things like, what did we ignore that we should have discussed? did any particular perspective dominate the discussions? did anyone feel silenced? if so, how and why? did the material get quality attention & thorough discussion? if not, why not? did we get sidetracked? how & why? etc., etc. I find this to be very vaulable. ----------- Ruth Ginzberg (rginzberg@eagle.wesleyan.edu) ------------ ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 11:07:00 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Debian Marty Subject: safe space > > I, too, am interested in lit sources on pedagogy and safe space. I often see > the term "safe space" used as a goal in feminist pedagogy but the term > remains > unpacked. It is simply employed. > > One of my concerns about the term that echoes what many others have said is > that i fear it masks the reinscription of privileged discourses and ways of > knowing/being into the classroom under the morally responsible trope of > safety. reinscribing privilege is certainly not all that "safe space" does, > but i think it ironically and perhaps unconsciously acts as a conduit for > validating privileged ways of talking, dealing with conflict, processing > information and feelings, that end up not only creating unsafe space but mask s > recognition of the very tensions it creates. > > yucky, isn't it? > > still contemplating, > debian marty > dmarty@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu > > oh, p.s. I see safe space employed in pedagogical literature that deals with > authority in the classroom. see, for example, Maher and Tetreault's new book > THE FEMINIST CLASSROOM (1994). it is a common dilemma. > > ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 10:14:09 -0600 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Linda Coleman Subject: safe space While any student dominating a classroom discussion should be attended to by the instructor, I think we might have some understanding of the varying motives for this behavior. Specifically, in response to an earlier posting, I wonder if when some students who strongly identify as feminists speak out in strong voices it is a result of the silencing they experience in other settings. To understand this does not mean that we accept their silencing effect within our classrooms but that we work from a sympathetic perspective in trying to resolve the conflict. -- Linda S. Coleman Eastern Illinois University cflsc@eiu.edu ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 09:46:27 -0800 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Susan Arpad Subject: Re: "Safe space" In-Reply-To: <199411031448.JAA29203@holmes.umd.edu> from "DAPHNE PATAI" at Nov 3, 94 09:47:01 am I could not let the statement, that a "few grandstanding feminists" are what make women's studies class feel unsafe, go by without comment. We must teach in very different situations. In the past 15 years of teaching women's studies classes the ratio is probably 1:20 of feminists who make the classroom feel hostile to anti-feminists (women and men) who make the classroom feel unsafe. Susan_Arpad@CSUFresno.edu ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 09:02:05 -0800 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Madelyn Detloff <6500mad@UCSBUXA.UCSB.EDU> Subject: Re: safe space In-Reply-To: <199411031616.LAA01794@holmes.umd.edu> I once had a colleague in Confluent Ed. advise me that responsibility entails the "ability to respond." This may seem like a tautology, but it has helped me in my attempt to keep the classroom open to conflicting ideas without my feeling unable to intervene when someone makes a racist or homophobic or misogynist comment. I feel that I am being responsible to my students when I take the time to respond to such a comment or, better yet, invite response from the rest of the class. Sometimes just that invitation is all it takes for quiet students to offer a thoughtful response to the comment. It's also important for me to assume that comments are offered with best intentions for furthering discussion. Certainly somtimes comments aren't offered with best intentions, but taking them this way, acknowledging the negative consequences, and then using that comment to further discussion of the issues (rather than persons) often will defuse some of the tension in the room. Also, on difficult topics like violence against women, racism or homophobia, i find it helpful to remind them that there most likely are people in the room who are directly affected by the issues we discuss. I might say something like "one in four college women has been the survivor of attempted rape." The students usually can figure out the math and realize that in a large class, they should assume that there are a number of survivors in the classroom. I prefer to acknowledge personal experience in this general sort of way beforehand, so that students don't feel they have to offer painful personal testimony in order to make the rest of the students in the class understand that the ideas we discuss in class aren't just esoteric academic exercises, that they have material effects on flesh-and-blood people. Madelyn Detloff 6500mad@ucsbuxa.ucsb.edu ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 10:06:13 -0700 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Marilyn Edelstein Subject: Re: contemp lit of transformation One great source for scenes of physical transformation in postmodern lit. is Donald Barthelme's novel _The Dead Father_, in which the "dead" father turns himself into showers of gold, creatures, etc.--in parodies of Ovidian metamorphosis, really (and the whole novel's an interrogation of the Oedipus complex--ironic and parodic and, some critics have argued, feminist). I think there may be other transformations in his short stories, too. Since you'd asked about "canonical" postmodernists, you might also want to think about John Barth's _Chimera_ (also ironically recycling of lots of Greek myths). It might be worth going backwards to include Gogol's classic "The Nose," in which the protagonist just becomes a giant walking nose. I hope you'll post the results of your query to the list (although you hadn't asked for specifically feminist sources or works by women, even though you'd said you were focusing on sexuality). Marilyn Edelstein, English, Santa Clara U ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 09:15:33 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Jenifer Ward Subject: Barbara Ehrenreich contact info Excuse the general posting to Wmst-L--I had already deleted the request for contact info for Barbara Ehrenreich. But here it is, courtesy of one of my colleagues: "She can contact Barbara Ehrenreich through Keppler Associates, 4350 North Fairfax Drive, Suite 700, Arlington VA 22203. Their phone number is 703-516- 4000; and their FAX is 703-516-4819. There is as yet no E-Mail address. Theo Moll is their account executive, with whom I worked to get Ehrenreich here, and she is very helpful." Jenifer Ward Foreign Languages Rhodes College ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 13:12:07 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Cheryl Sattler Subject: Why God Never Received Tenure At the risk of offending a few and amusing many, this message was passed along to me by way of a woman at NASA: Why God Never Received Tenure at Any University: > > 1. He had only one major publication. > 2. It was in Hebrew. > 3. It had no references. > 4. It wasn't published in a refereed journal. > 5. Some even doubt he wrote it himself. > 6. It may be true that he created the world, but what has he done since then? > 7. His cooperative efforts have been quite limited. > 8. The scientific community has had a hard time replicating his results. > 9. He never applied to the Ethics Board for permission to use human subjects. > 10. When one experiment went awry he tried to cover it up by drowning the > subjects. > 11. When subjects didn't behave as predicted, he deleted them from the sample. > 12. He rarely came to class, just told students to read the Book. > 13. Some say he had his son teach the class. > 14. He expelled his first two students for learning. > 15. Although there were only ten requirements, most students failed his tests. > 16. His office hours were infrequent and usually held on a mountain top. Cheryl _________________ Cheryl Sattler, Ph.D. Florida State University FAX (904) 644-0643 PHONE (904) 644-1142 internet: sattler@bio.fsu.edu ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 10:31:39 -0800 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Cecilia Julagay Subject: Re: beyond "safe space" Last spring after agreeing to teach a class on "Racial and Cultural Minorities," I was talking to two veterans of this class - they both related tales of yelling matches in the class, unhappy students, poor teacher evaluations, etc. I decided to confront the situation head on. The first day of class, before I said anything, I wrote 2 quotes on the board: Education is the not the filling of a pail, but the lighting of a fire. -William Butler Yeats ... diversity is like fire. When controlled and stimulated, fire can drive turbines to light cities and run factories. Out of control, it can destroy everything that it helped build. - B. Eugene Griessman, in: Diversity: Challenges & Opportunities I explained to the class that the 1st quote indicated that I expected students to interact in the classroom - with each other, the course material and life experiences. The 2nd quote was to remind them that the fire referred to in quote 1 was to be a "controlled burn." There was going to be no tolerance for anyone putting anybody else down. As far as possible all individuals would be allowed to present their view, providing that they didn't put anybody else down. The class turned out to be a wonderful class. I witnessed students of very diverse backgrounds backing each other up, etc. There seemed to be much growth in the students - and in me - I came away feeling more confident. - Cecilia Julagay@ucrac1.ucr.edu ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 10:37:00 -0700 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Karen Kidd Subject: Re: Why God Never Received Tenure Thanks for the best laugh I've had all day. But despite all the reasons listed, I think we know the REAL reason: God's a Female! -- Karen Kidd ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 14:03:39 EST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Diane Miller Subject: Passionate Scholarship I wondr if someone can help me with a citation. I am looking for an article (it may bea chapter in an edited collection) entitled "Passionate Scholarship," or something close to that. I think the author is Ellen DuBois. Does anyone know where I can find it? Thank you! Diane Miller Dept. of Speech Communication University of Georgia Athens, GA 30602 DMILLER@UGA.CC.UGA.EDU ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 11:22:16 -0400 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: BHOWARD Subject: Re: DATELINE NBC Theresa, I read something about this (breast cancer & abortion) in the New York Times last week; but the Times reported it as very ambiguous research. Becky Howard ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 14:42:29 -0400 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: David Merchant Subject: Re: beyond "safe space" In-Reply-To: <01HJ1NCIYDKY8WXYZ1@utkvx.utk.edu> Excellent! I am keeping a copy of your post. That second quote especially: we need to teach that to everyone. Ta-Ta For Now, David @::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: Merchant@utkvx.utk.edu University of Tennessee Celebrate DIversIty School of Information Science @::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: Sometimes, the dragon shoots diversity out of its mouth.... ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 15:36:29 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: DAPHNE PATAI Subject: Re: "Safe space" In-Reply-To: <199411031748.MAA03721@holmes.umd.edu> from "Susan Arpad" at Nov 3, 94 09:46:27 am Susan, I'm very heartened that you teach in such a different sort of program, though I assure you my comment was based on far more than my own personal experience and observations. Your message reminded me that I needed to correct one implication of my comment: it's not just grandstanding feminist *students* who are the problem; similar-minded faculty are too. -- ====================== Daphne.Patai@spanport.umass.edu ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 16:01:53 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: DAPHNE PATAI Subject: god's tenure In-Reply-To: <199411031839.NAA05235@holmes.umd.edu> from "Karen Kidd" at Nov 3, 94 10:37:00 am The way I heard the tale, the reason god didn't get tenure was because he was in a women's studies program and careful review at an all-day non-hierarchical meeting, attended by faculty; clerical, professional, and janitorial staff; and student representatives of the women's studies program, lamentably exposed the following facts (note * - see below): 1) he was under the delusion that he was male 2) he was uncooperative about bringing cooked food to program events, preferring to create new species instead, which revealed an overbearing, non-communitarian-minded spirit 3) he was overly invested in the written word 4) he facilely doled out prohibitions and punishments 5) his bibliography was a) too long, b) mired in patriarchal imagery, and c) failed to cite his female predecessors, thus d) reflecting a linear, non-interactive approach, which, alas, revealed his poor grasp of: e) feminist process and the art of negotiation. The discussion, of course, resulted in a consensus, hence no vote was taken. _______________ * For purposes of this meeting, facticity was accorded a positive value. -- ====================== Daphne.Patai@spanport.umass.edu ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 15:45:43 EST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Rosa Maria Pegueros Subject: Safe space (LONG--) I am always astonished at the venom directed at diversity. When I look back on my own college and law school experience, I see nothing that resembles safe space for anyone except perhaps egotistical male professors. I remember professors who used their authority to skewer students, male and female, though the women were privileged in that only they were the butts of sexual jokes both from male students as well as faculty. My male Black and Latino classmates (of whom there were very few) were not the objects of any kind of attention, good or bad: they were invisible, and thus ignored. To be fair, I did have some fine professors (all male, I might add), but never saw anything that resembled anything in my experience--neither women nor Latino/a professors, nor works by Latinos/as. The message that came through loud and clear was that there were too few of us to be important and the works from authors of our region were too lowly for consideration. And since the only students of color in my university class were unquestionably affirmative action students, ie., members of the football or basketball team, I could not help wondering how I got past the gate keepers. Gabriel Garcia Marquez's *One Hundred Years of Solitude* was not published in English until I was in my last year of college. But the book that preceded Marquez and which some say inspired him to write his book, *Recollections of Things to Come* by Elena Garro of Mexico, did not see publication in English until long after that. For all the exposure I had in literature classes in college to Latin American literature, one would have believed that all of Latin America was pre-literate. Forgive me if I write with such passion about this, but I feel deeply that these issues, multiculturalism, diversity, women's studies and safe space are related. Part of the influence of women in the university is seen in the desire to create safe space--for all students, not just for women, and not just as victims. Why should learning be an adversarial process? It is arguable that if you are being trained to be a lawyer exposure to that method is neces- sary, but if we are teaching literature, philosophy, history, whatever, what good can come from having a classroom that is not "safe space"? I think that the desire to hold on to the canon is a desire to have a rigid, inflexible standard and that this is a remnant of the colonial past. We are a vibrant society, rich in ethnicities, races, cultures, and women (in the sense that women have finally gained the right to have public lives) and we should feast on these riches. I read and loved Plato, Aristotle, and many of the classics, but had I not become immersed in my own culture, I never would have known that there are great works that rival the thinking and the beauty of expression in the classics. Rosa Maria Pegueros ....................................................................... Rosa Maria Pegueros e-mail: pegueros@uriacc.uri.edu Department of History telephone: (401) 792-4092 217C Washburn Hall University of Rhode Island Kingston, RI 02881-0817 "Women hold up half the sky." ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 17:41:22 -0500 Reply-To: Mary Petrie Sender: Women's Studies List From: Mary Petrie Subject: Sum of feminist critique of AA Since many people requested this, I've summarized the replies I got to my query for citations, info on feminist critiques of AA. Many thanks to everyone who responded, especially Sidney Matrix. TO PEOPLE REQUESTING MORE INFO ON MY RESEARCH: I've saved all your posts and will mail a summary of results and bibliography when I'm done. Expect it in about a month to six weeks. Here's what the list gave me. Thanks again, Mary Feminist Critique of AA and related readings on women, addiction, dependency: Travis, Carol, Mismeasure of Women (book) (chapter on diagnosing the mind deals with co-dependency Tallen, Bette, "Twelve Step Programs: A Lesbian Feminist Critique" NWSA Journal 2:3 Summer 1990 Ettorre, Betsy, "Women and Substance Use/Abuse: Toward A Feminist Perspective, Or, How to Make Dust Fly" Women Studies International Forum 12:6 p593ff 1989 Schrager Cynthia d. "Questioning the Promise of Self Help: A Reading of Women Who Love Too Much" Feminist Studies 19:1 p177ff 1993 Alcoff Linda and Laura Gray, "Survivor Discourse: Transgression Or Recuperation?" SIGNS 18:2, p260ff Haaken Janice "From Al-Anon to ACOA: codependence and the reconstruction of caregiving" SIGNS 18:2p 321ff Mackinnon Marilyn ed. (book) Each Small Step: Breaking the Chains of Abuse and Addiction (An Anthology of Writing By and For Women . . . ) Gynergy Books 1991 Katz, Stan and Aimee Liu (book) The codependency conspiracy. Warner Books 1991 Rachel V. (book) A Woman Like You: Life Stories of Women Recovering From Alcoholism and addiction. Harper and Row, 1985 ** Wendy Kaminer, book -- I'm Dysfunctional/Your're Dysfunctional (highly recommended by a number of people as easy to read, informative) don't know author for this book, Women and Self Help Culture ***************************** Mary Petrie Department of English and Commission on Women 410 Morrill Hall University of Minnesota Minneapolis MN 55455 petr0013@gold.tc.umn.edu ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 18:48:12 EST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Georgia NeSmith Subject: "grandstanding feminists" Like Susan Arpad, I really must take issue with the "grandstanding feminists" phrase used by Daphne Patai. I am sure that many of my students and colleagues would consider me to be a "grandstanding feminist," though probably not with those exact words. Feminism, regardless of the type, is a scare word these days (as if it had every been anything else). The passionate commitment to ANY social movement is suspect to most people in this country, whether in the academy or elsewhere. Thanks to Reagan, Bush, "Flush Limberger" and their ilk, merely identifying oneself as a feminist makes one a "grandstanding feminist." The phrase strikes me as an all-too-easy label to be attached to any feminist, particularly those who are not "nice" i.e., are not deferential to men (yes, I know a few women who call themselves feminist but are exceedingly deferential to men for fear they will be called "man-haters"). I would like to know exactly how one qualifies as a "grandstanding feminist." Georgia NeSmith Rochester NY ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 18:59:34 EST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Rosa Maria Pegueros Subject: Passionate Politics I think you may be thinking of "Passionate Politics: Feminist Theory in Action" (Essays 1968-1986) by Charlotte Bunch. Rosa Maria Pegueros ....................................................................... Rosa Maria Pegueros e-mail: pegueros@uriacc.uri.edu Department of History telephone: (401) 792-4092 217C Washburn Hall University of Rhode Island Kingston, RI 02881-0817 "Women hold up half the sky." ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 19:39:47 EST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Susan Canty Quinlan Subject: Re: "grandstanding feminists" In-Reply-To: Message of Thu, 3 Nov 1994 18:48:12 EST from It seems to me that Daphne makes herself exceedingly clear about what constitutes a grandstanding feminist in her book PROFESSING FEMINISM (with Noretta Koertge) abracos da Susan Susan C. Quinlan Kindness is a lot like snow. Department of Romance Languages Everything it covers is beautiful. University of Georgia Athens, GA. 30602-1815 706-542-3161 FAX 706-542-3287 ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 19:46:49 EST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: "John C. Berg" Subject: Sex and the Civil Rights Act I am grateful to Jo Freeman for her comments about Howard W. Smith and the Civil Rights Act's sex discrimination clause--especially since I may be guilty of adopting part of the story she criticizes in my just published "Unequal Struggle: Class, Gender, Race, and Power in the U.S. Congress", where I use thiss event as an example in the chapter on Congress and women. I will, of course, check her article, which I have not seen (nor have I seen the MS. article she criticizes). But as to her question about where the story comes from--surely it originates with the chapter "Lady's Day in the House" in Caroline Bird's BORN FEMALE. At least Bird's version (which I relied on) is that Smith was not joking, but trying to kill the Civil Rights bill. She does also point out, though, that his amendment would not have been adopted if Martha Griffith had not spoken out strongly in favor of it-- and reports, based on an interview with Griffith, that the latter had planned to offer a similar amendment her- self, but supported Smith's instead in order to increase the amendment's chances of winning. I am eager to read Freeman's and Brauer's articles to see whether my use of this story was unfounded. John Berg j.berg@acad.suffolk.edu ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 20:02:00 EDT Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Joan Korenman Subject: When to Reply Privately (User's Guide) Each month, I post sections from the WMST-L User's Guide to remind subscribers of the list's resources and procedures. If changes have been made since the last time a section was posted, the subject header will begin "Revision:". Also, you can now consult the User's Guide anytime you'd like if you have access to gopher. Gopher to gopher.umbc.edu and select Academic Department Info (currently #5), then Women's Studies (currently #9), then WMST-L (currently #5). Meanwhile, here is perhaps the most important section, on when to reply privately rather than to the list: ******************* 3) "WHEN SHOULD I REPLY PRIVATELY RATHER THAN TO WMST-L?" WMST-L is set up so that replies will automatically go to all subscribers. If you respond to a WMST-L message by hitting a reply key or typing "reply," everyone will read your response. This is appropriate when the contents are likely to be of interest to a number of subscribers (most suggestions for reading lists and teaching strategies fall into this category). However, if you are writing to request a copy of a paper someone has mentioned, please send your request PRIVATELY, NOT to WMST-L. Similarly, comments directed at a particular person (e.g., "Right on, Rhoda. Good point," or "Thanks for the info," or "What a horrendous experience that must have been. I don't know why people do such things," or "Hi, Jane, I'm glad to see you've joined the list. Write to me," etc.) should be sent PRIVATELY, NOT to WMST-L. Also, short general statements of approval or disapproval (e.g., "Hooray! I'm glad someone finally said that!" or "I can't imagine how anyone can believe such nonsense") should NOT be sent to WMST-L. One further note: the above sorts of messages are OMITTED from the WMST-L digest. If the person you're trying to reach is one of the hundreds who reads WMST-L in digest form, she/he will not see the message if you send it to WMST-L. ******************* Joan Korenman Internet: korenman@umbc2.umbc.edu Bitnet: korenman@umbc ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 20:27:26 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List Comments: Warning -- RSCS tag indicates an origin of $SMTPSRV@UMDD From: Michele Forte Subject: women's studies and social welfare Since the list members have been so generous in responding to my inquiries, I would like to make another request. My fields are Women's Studies and Social Welfare and I am interested in talking with other women who have similar interests. I am specifically interested in subscribing to other e-mail lists which might have a mroe interdisciplinary focus. If anyone out there knows of any good resources, I would really appreciate you passing them along to me. I would be happy to pass any responses along to anyone interested. Please respondprivately and thank you all in advance for your help and suggestions!! Michele Forte mf7175@cnsvax.albany.edu ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Nov 1994 19:16:09 -0800 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: ME Subject: Joanna Russ and K/S writers Thanks to the many people on the list who responded to my query about a Joanna Russ article on women writers of K/S zines. Here are the references people suggested: Joanna Russ, article in her book, _Magic Mommas, Trembling Sisters, Puritans and Perverts (Crossing Press, 1985). Someone thought there might be a new edition of this coming out. Camille Bacon-Smith, _Enterprising Women_ (U Penn, 1993). Henry Jenkins III, article in Constance Penley, ed. _Close Encounters_ (U Minn, 1991). Constance Penley, "Feminism, Psychoanalysis, and the Study of Popular Culture," in Bryson, Moxey, Holly, eds., _Visual Culture_ (Wesleyan; UP of New England, 1994). Unidentified article in NY Times book review. Unidentified Joanna Russ article in a fanzine. Thanks again for all your responses. Mary Eichbauer gg-mee@ix.netcom.com ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Nov 1994 01:33:29 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: cardav@PAVO.CONCORDIA.CA Subject: Gendered language and hermeneutics I would appreciate it if someone out there could provide me with a few sources on the complex topic of women, language and gendered hermeneutics. I am presently doing work on the 18th century--specifically on the work of Samuel Richardson--Clarissa and Pamela, to be exact. I have found some information on the topic of gendered hermeneutics in Ellen Pollak's The Poetics of Sexual Myth: Gender and Ideology in the Verse of Swift and Pope, but I would appreciate hearing from anyone who might know of other studies of this nature. Also, I am perplexed by a passage in Clarissa (letter 473) where John Belford writes to Lovelace: "Thou art a merciless master. The two fellows are *battered* to death by thee, to use a female word; and all female words, though we are not sure of their derivation, have very significant meanings. I believe, in their hearts, they wish the angel in the heaven that is ready to receive her, and thee at thy proper place, that there might be an end of their *flurries*; another word of the same gender." To what theory or idea is Belford referring to with regard to gendered words? Does anyone have a clue? Thanks in advance. Carol Davison cardav@pavo.concordia.ca ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Nov 1994 10:03:02 +0100 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Janis Bourne Subject: Female Circumcision Hi, I am researching Female Circumcision as part of MA Womens Studies. I am new to the Internet, can you help me in any way, regards bibliographies, current papers etc. Please reply PRIVATELY. Many thanks Janis Bourne Staffordshire University sc2bgpd@CR41.STAFFS.AC.UK. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Nov 1994 09:43:53 EST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: STRETCH OR DROWN/ EVOLVE OR DIE Subject: Re: Gendered language and hermeneutics I would think the passage from Clarissa to which Carol is referring is talking about the gendering of nouns which would in the 18th century have been derived from Latin grammars. If you recall Latin nouns have grammatical gender; they are either masculine, feminine, or neuter. Many 18th century grammarians attempted to apply this system to English on the assumption that if Latin nouns had gender, then English nouns must also have it. There is a good discussion of the concept of grammatical gender in Julia Penelope's book Speaking Freely: Unlearning the Lies of the Father Tongue (Teachers' College Press), chapter 4. ,,, (o o) +-------------------------------oOOo-(_)-oOOo--------------------------------+ | Laurie Finke, Women's and Gender Studies, Kenyon College | | Gambier, OH 43022 phone: 614-427-5276 | | home: 614-427-3428, P.O. Box 731 mail: FinkeL@Kenyon.Edu | +----------------------------------------------------------------------------+ () () ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Nov 1994 09:40:29 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Helen Susan Edelman Subject: Re: DATELINE NBC This feels very prolifer to me, this abortion-breast cancer report. One more thing to make women feel guilty, ashamed, afraid and self-destructive. Helen Edelman ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Nov 1994 09:56:50 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Lucy Candib MD Subject: citation on passionate scholarship Barbara DuBois: Passionate scholarship: Notes on values, knowing and method in feminist Social Science. In Gloria Bowles and Renate Duelli Klein, Theories of Women's Studies. Boston: Routledge & Kegan Paul, 1983, pp. 105-116. Lucy M. Candib, M.D. Family Health and Social Service Center 875 Main St. Worcester, Massachusetts 01610 508-756-3528 lcandib@umassmed.ummed.edu ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Nov 1994 09:57:00 EDT Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Joan Korenman Subject: Authorization to post messages (User's Guide) Each month, I post sections from the WMST-L User's Guide to remind subscribers of the list's resources and procedures. If changes have been made since the last time a section was posted, the subject header will begin "Revision:". Also, you can now consult the User's Guide anytime you'd like if you have access to gopher. Gopher to gopher.umbc.edu and select Academic Department Info (currently #5), then Women's Studies (currently #9), then WMST-L (currently #5). Meanwhile, here is the section explaining why you may get a message telling you you're not authorized to post messages. 4) "I'VE TRIED TO POST A MESSAGE TO THE LIST, BUT I RECEIVED A MESSAGE BACK SAYING THAT I'M NOT AUTHORIZED TO DO SO. I'M A SUBSCRIBER--WHY WAS I TOLD I'M NOT AUTHORIZED?" Only people whom the LISTSERV software recognizes as subscribers can post messages on WMST-L. To subscribe, send the following message to LISTSERV@UMDD (Bitnet) or LISTSERV@UMDD.UMD.EDU (Internet): SUB WMST-L Your Name (e.g., SUB WMST-L Jane Smith). If you've already subscribed to WMST-L and you run into problems, chances are that you subscribed under a different address than the one from which you sent your recent message--e.g., you subscribed under your Bitnet address and then sent a message from your Internet address. The LISTSERV software recognizes subscribers by their e-mail address. If you subscribe under a Bitnet [or Internet] address, you have to send all messages to LISTSERV and WMST-L from that same address. If you are unsuccessful posting a message to the list's Bitnet address, try sending the message to the list's Internet address. If your e-mail address has changed since you subscribed, please contact me PRIVATELY (not via a message to WMST-L). ****************** Joan Korenman Internet: korenman@umbc2.umbc.edu Bitnet: korenman@umbc ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Nov 1994 10:10:59 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: DAPHNE PATAI Subject: Re: "grandstanding feminists" In-Reply-To: <199411032352.SAA13605@holmes.umd.edu> from "Georgia NeSmith" at Nov 3, 94 06:48:12 pm I really must take issue, as it were so to speak, with Georgia's interpretation of my comment. Though I do not think being "nice" to men should be taken as a mark that one is NOT a feminist, it happens that I was speaking about "grandstanding feminists" who direct their more-perfect-than-thou feminism at other WOMEN, not men. Thus I don't quite see the relevance of Georgia's 'spin' on my words. -- ====================== Daphne.Patai@spanport.umass.edu ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Nov 1994 10:24:56 EST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Katherine Side Subject: NWSA - Jewish Caucus Is there anyone that can help me by passing on the name of the person that coordinates the Jewish Causus for the National Women's Studies Assocaition. It would be wonderful if their e-mail number was also available. Thanks in advance. Katherine Side klside@vm1.yorku.ca ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Nov 1994 10:27:56 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List Comments: Warning -- RSCS tag indicates an origin of $SMTPSRV@UMDD From: Helen Susan Edelman Subject: abortion narratives I am doing research on how women who have abortions come to terms with their grief over the pregnancy loss. My research shows that "loss" is only dealt with in terms of miscarriage or stillbirth -- but the women I speak with who have had abortions also say they needed to mourn -- the end of the baby, the end of a relationship perhaps, the end of a possibility for being a mother at that time Etc. Yes, and other women say they did not grieve at all. If you are willing to speak with me about your abortion, or to answer a questionnaire, please let me know at in%"he4801@cnsvax.albany.edu" ABSOLUTE CONFIDENTIALITY GUARANTEED. To be clear about my own stake in this: I had an abortion in 1983, and did grieve it as a loss. It also ended my marriage. Ten years later when I was remarried and pregnant, my ex-husband called to apologize for the pressure he put me under to terminate the pregnancy. It took hi a long time to think about it. Incidentally, I am a strong pro-choice advocate and a supporter and contributor to Planned parenthood. T%his is not a pro-life project, but a project to examine how women can access a support system for this particular grief in a culture which denies that abortion should entail it because it's legal but 1. secretive 2. elective 3. shameful. Any comments would be appreciated. Helen Edelman ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Nov 1994 10:29:26 -0400 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: David Merchant Subject: Re: Female Circumcision In-Reply-To: <01HJ2ILDYA6A8WXB2D@utkvx.utk.edu> I will be sending you shortly about 30 bibliographic citations I found while searching on the Dialog (c) databases. Dialog (c) is a bit inconsistent in its format from one database to the next, so some came with abstracts and even a couple with the full text of the article, so it is a long email, I warn you. These are articles from 1990-1994. Hope they help! Ta-Ta For Now, David @::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: Merchant@utkvx.utk.edu University of Tennessee Celebrate DIversIty School of Information Science @::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Nov 1994 11:03:38 EST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List Comments: Converted from PROFS to RFC822 format by PUMP V2.2X From: Rebecca Leist Sturgeon Subject: Composition Studies Graduate Teaching Assistant--English Phone: 588-5921 I am doing research about women age 35-50 in first-y ear composition courses. Right now, I am interested in linking the idea of writing the body to the particular needs of these students, but I would like to continue and expand this project into a dissertation. Can anyone help me with sources from any field that deal with: 1. the body in feminist pedagogy, 2. narratives from women who return to college after raising a family, working, etc., 3. anything else--- I'm in a very exploratory stage right now. Many thanks. ---RLS ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Nov 1994 11:05:00 CST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: jane rickman Subject: book contribution Dr. Constance Lindemann and dr. Barbara Hillyer are preparing ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Nov 1994 11:11:00 CST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: jane rickman Subject: answering question I just goofed when I attempted to send this before. forgive Now. Dr. Constance Lindemann and Dr. Barbara Hillyer are preparing material for a "popular" book. They ask that you answer only one question and provide some information about yourself. The form follows. How has the Women's Movement changed your life? 100-200 or more words. then an inquiry. Tell us who you are (e.g. homemaker, teacher, retired secretary, waitress and mother of four. What is your FAVORITE thing to do? Your age? Woman or Man..check one Where are you from? What else is important to you? no limit on this input Please send by e-mail to AA0939@UOKMVSA.backbone.UOKNOE. no---that's incorrect let me start over. e-mail AA0939@UOKMVSA.backbone.UOKNOR.ed. snailmail...Dr. Barbara Hillyer, Department of Human Relations, University of Oklahoma, Norman, OK 73019 Thank you. Please reply privately to Dr. Hillyer. Thank you. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Nov 1994 09:38:57 -0800 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: pfish Subject: abortion and breast cancer Here is the information about the breast cancer/abortion study. It is not ambiguous research, as someone suggested. As usual, what you hear from the media is them playing it up from every angle. Here's the official statement from the National Cancer Institute: Abortion and Possible Risk for Breast Cancer: Analysis and Inconsistencies A study reported in the Nov. 2 issue of the Journal of the National Cancer Institute (JNCI) on induced abortion and risk for breast cancer discusses whether an association exists, but the findings are not conclusive. Further research is needed to interpret the results. The research was independently conducted by Janet Daling, Ph.D., Fred Hutchinson Cancer Research Center, University of Washington, Seattle, and colleagues. [Note: The paper is titled "Risk of breast cancer among young women: Relationship to induced abortion." The authors are Janet R. Daling, Kathleen E. Malone, Lynda F. Voigt, Emily White, and Noel S. Weiss, of the Fred Hutchinson Cancer Research Center, University of Washington, Seattle.] The study suggests that women age 45 or younger who have had induced abortions have a relative risk of 1.5 (50 percent increased risk) for breast cancer compared to women who had been pregnant but never had an induced abortion. In epidemiologic research, relative risks of less than 2 are considered small and are usually difficult to interpret. Such increases may be due to chance, statistical bias, or effects of confounding factors that are sometimes not evident. In an editorial accompanying the study, Lynn Rosenberg, Sc.D., Boston University School of Medicine, points out that a "difference in risk of 50 percent (relative risk of 1.5) is small in epidemiologic terms [human population studies], and severely challenges our ability to distinguish whether it reflects cause and effect or whether it simply reflects bias." Rosenberg notes that "the overall results as well as the particulars are far from conclusive, and it is difficult to see how they will be informative to the public." Daling and colleagues did not find a consistent pattern of increasing or decreasing risk associated with age at abortion, as would be expected by many scientists. (Risk was greater for women who had their first induced abortion before age 18 (relative risk of 2.5) and for women who were 30 years of age or older (relative risk of 2.1).) Furthermore, the risk did not vary by number of abortions, whether abortion preceded or followed a full-term pregnancy, or by length of time to diagnosis of breast cancer. One key point is that women aged 45 or younger who had miscarriages were not found to be at increased risk for breast cancer. Taken together, the inconsistencies and scarcity of existing research do not permit scientific conclusions. In the Daling study, the researchers analyzed data on 845 white women who were diagnosed with invasive or in situ breast cancer from 1983 to 1990 and 961 control subjects. All the women were born after 1944. Data were collected on reproductive history, family history of breast and other cancers, and life-style and other factors. The study population was from three counties in Washington State. Only white women were included in the study because of the small minority population in this area. The researchers also found that risk for breast cancer was more enhanced for women having an induced abortion prior to age 18 if their pregnancy was interrupted during the 9-to-24-week period of gestation. However, this finding was based on small numbers. Studies published in the JNCI are peer-reviewed by scientists and represent the views of the authors. Papers published in the journal do not necessarily reflect the views held by NCI or any other component of the federal government. Pia Fish / Assistant Head of Library Services Fred Hutchinson Cancer Research Center / Seattle pfish@cclink.fhcrc.org ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Nov 1994 11:32:03 -0700 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: "Ruth Dickstein, University of Arizona Main Library" Subject: Cite by Barbara Du Bois Someone was looking for the source where Barbara Du Bois' "Passionate scholarship: Notes on values, knowing and method in feminist social science". It is in an antholody entitled Theories of Women's Studies, edited by Renate Duelli-Klein and Gloria Bowles, published by Routledge & Kegan, 1983. As an aside I found this information in my recently published Index to Anthologies in Women's Studies 1980-1984. If your library doesn't have a copy, ask them to order it. (But I am sorry to say, it is pretty pricy). ruth dickstein dickstei ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Nov 1994 13:45:49 EST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Mary Ann Cain Subject: Re: abortion and breast cancer I am curious as to the justification for researching connections between abortion and breast cancer. Why study such relationship? ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Nov 1994 13:53:44 -0600 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Sarah Ullman Re: safe space discussion I teach a course on victimization and the issues of rape, domestic violence and child sexual abuse usually bring up debates about feminist issues, as we examine a variety of perspectives on the causes, consequences, and prevention of these crimes. This is an advanced seminar course and though sometimes people relate accounts of crimes that they know about in their social network or in the media when we discuss a particular topic (e.g., when we discussed domestic violence/battering, one woman talked about how she is affected by neighbors where she lives in which this is occurring on a regular basis). Such examples bring the academic material to life and help us sort through what we think of different theories of victimization. Gender and race are salient issues and I attempt to allow all perspectives to be heard and to add ones that I see are missing when that occurs. I am careful to give all students equal 'air time' and not to 'favor' certain viewpoints over each other, in order to permit students to air views even when they know will be criticized by others. I also try to model constructive responses myself that acknowledge what the person says and their right to their opinion, but also does not simply agree with everything, if I think there are reasons to be critical of the viewpoint. I am careful to focus the discussion on the articles we are reading, but also to allow time for viewpoints to be expressed, and will sparingly let them know my own viewpoints, as I think that is also important. (I am sure my attempts are not totally effective in making people feel free to state all their views, but I think one can only do one's best to approximate this as much as possible). I find the men and women in the class freely express their views in this context, of course there may be views that are not expressed, and some males tend to support a more feminist perspective while others are staunchly against it. There is also variability in women students on this as well. I bring up theories about race, gender, class that inform the understanding of victimization, yet I also review classical theories some of which do not address these issues as I want them to see the variety of perspectives that exist and think about them critically. I find that students are shocked at the statistics and scope of many forms of victimization and that alone takes time to process. I have found that the atmosphere that is created allows the exchange of ideas and even some personal experiences of victimization as they come up. There have not been problems in the classroom thus far of students disclosing emotional distress or their own personal experiences that they need help for. Where that does happen is outside of class, when they sometimes come to me to tell me about experiences they have had/are having, as they perceive the topic of the seminar and my demeanor to be receptive to that, which I am. I listen to those experiences and try to help them find resources. I make clear that I am not a clinician both I the classroom and outside. Students often simply want acknowledgement of their experiences and guidance about where to find help for themselves or others they know. I do acknowledge to them that all of this information is a lot to take in as it was for me, and sometimes still is, when I first learned about it. I think one can acknowledge a student's viewpoint or feeling (those two things are not always separate) without having the classroom turn into a therapy-like environment. I have had very positive evaluations of this course from the students, so hopefully this is a good sign that the atmosphere is a constructive learning environment. Sarah Ullman, Ph.D. Assistant Professor Department of Criminal Justice University of Illinois at Chicago ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Nov 1994 15:50:16 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Laurie Kingston Subject: feminist critique of AA The author of _Women_and_Self-Help_Culture_ is Wendy Simonds and the publiher is Rutgers University Press (1992) Thanks for posting list of resources, Mary! Laurie Kingston ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Nov 1994 13:54:44 -0800 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Terry Brenda Jackson Subject: Re: News Item re: Police Response to the Rape of an Elderly Woman In-Reply-To: <199411041705.MAA28604@holmes.umd.edu> A news item on the iTV News, Edmonton, Alberta, Canada. A 65 year old woman is forced from her home. She is raped at knife point on the grounds outside her apartment building. The response from a police spokesman is that rape is a terrible crime whenever it happens, but even more heinous when perpetrated against an elderly woman. Why should rape be a more heinous crime for the elderly than for the young? I think the subtext here has less to do with the age of the victim than with tenacious and erroneous belief that rape is a sexual crime instead of a violent one. What I conclude from the officer's comments is that if the crime of rape against an elderly woman is even more "heinous" than the same crime perpetrated against a young woman, it is because it is much more difficult to construct the crime as an exaggeration of normal sexuality. Therefore, the 20 year old who rapes a 65 year old is deemed perverse--a violent criminal. On the other hand, if his victim had been a 20 year he would have been expressing natural, albeit exaggerated, sexual behaviour. I hope that I am not the only one who finds the police officer's response, as well as the media's airing of the same, revealing and disturbing. Terry Jackson jacksont.ugrad.unbc.edu ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Nov 1994 17:36:25 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: SueBD@AOL.COM Subject: Re: Safe Space Greetings, all I am speaking here from the viewpoint of both a student and a teacher. I'm not sure either how I would define "safe space" in a classroom, but I know I have experienced it. I took Psychology of Women and Intro to Women's Studies from a woman PhD candidate with some interesting qualifications: she has an MSW and practiced as a social worker before she went back for her PhD in social psychology. Thus she has considerable small group and even therapy experience. She is very accessible and approachable. The atmosphere she is able to create ensures that everyone feels "safe" to express their views on a subject without being ridiculed or ignored. Inclusivity, acceptance, and sensitivity to different cultural realities is emphasized. Furthermore, people sometimes even revealed events of a highly subjective painful type, illustrating that people generally felt "safe." Our class in Psychology of Women consisted of a lesbian, a couple of men, several African American women, and some white women of various ages, and although we had some really rousing discussions, I don't recall that we ever really felt "unsafe." Part of her teaching style is to employ a lot of this type of safe discussion. Another part of it is to require a personal journal that is read (and commented on briefly) only by her. A journal allows the student to process information that may strike a more personal chord without revealing it in front of the rest of the class. I think the material uncovered in a Women's Studies-type class is not merely "academic" information, but it also touches women's lives in a way that most other academic subjects do not. The journal allows a "safe" way to express these thoughts and feelings. Another teaching technique she has employed on occasion is to require students to Email each other weekly with comments on the class material. This, in my opinion, really built group cohesiveness and stimulated discussion in a way entirely different from that in face-to-face interaction. More personal things were revealed "safely" than in class. So, this is my experience, and although I cannot define "safe space," I am certain that I experienced it. Sue Boettcher ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Nov 1994 17:06:05 CST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: "Dr. Carol Koehler" Subject: Any studies or general info on perceptions of women's studies across populations: i.e. administrators, faculty and students not actively participating in WS coursework? Carol Koehler Internet Addr: CKOEHLER@VAX1.UMKC.EDU ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Nov 1994 19:46:31 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Amy Goodle Subject: sources on WS classroom practice? I have been following the discussion of "safe space" in women's studies with some interest, and I'm finding that it has some bearing on a research project I am about to undertake. The project involves reviewing the literature on feminist pedagogy from past ten years, with a specific focus on classrooom practices in women's studies courses. I have not taught a women's studies course myself, but I have been an unhappy participant in several -- and this concerns me, because I believe that "ineffective" pedagogy is contrary to the goals of feminism. It sometimes amazes me how little training PhD students receive in "how to teach" their subjects, and I guess I feel that WS *ought* to be different -- and perhaps at some universities it is. I'm checking into PhD programs in WS now, and I hope to find one... The aim of my project is to analyze what "works" in WS classrooms, what doesn't, and WHY -- and I would like to know if anyone on the list can point me to scholarly pieces on the subject written in the past 10 years. The sources need to be VERY specific, dealing with *clasroom practice* on some level. I already know about _The Feminist Classroom_ and about the "feminist pedagogy" issue of WS Quarterly, but anything else you could point me to would be very much appreciated. I also searched on inforM and found a few items, but they weren't quite what I was looking for; I did not, however, check the WMST files, and perhaps I should??? Thanks in advance. Amy Goodloe agoodloe@mercury.sfsu.edu -or- Ruby8fruit@aol.com ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Nov 1994 21:22:26 -0400 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: David Merchant Subject: Re: News Item re: Police Response to the Rape of an Elderly Woman In-Reply-To: <01HJ3CNBOTO28WYQPR@utkvx.utk.edu> I agree. I have long had a problem with all the semantics around rape. We call it incest, assault, abuse, rape, etc, and the laws differ depending upon the semantics: but it is all the same damnable thing! They separate it, like Terry says, into levels of more or less terribleness depending upon age, and gender, and sexual orientation, and race of the victim(s) and the perpetrator(s). It is all one thing: Rape. As one survivor said, it is the second worse thing next to murder. Nothing else is worse, for it destroys who you are, and the rebuilding process is long, difficult and fraught with danger (almost every victim/surivor that has come to the Crisis Center has expressed strong, actual contemplations of suicide, and many have made attempts -- how many suicides are from rape? In that way rape IS * murder * ! I came close, very * close * to it myself, and there would have been no note, a shame and pain I would have taken with me.). I can not believe how damn prevalent rape myths are. That prostitutes can't be raped, of men only gay men are raped, that it is worse for the elderly than the young, etc, etc, etc, etc ad nasaeum. The Crisis Center once had a religious group contact them wanting the names (!) of all the male victims or at least info on how to get to their group meetings to save them from being gay as a result from being raped. These are the same kind of brain dead people who say lesbians are the results of rapes: the women turn from men, yet gay men are also the results of rapes: they turn toward men? Huh? What? Or maybe they think only gays are raped ... I am digressing, years later and the nerve is still tender. I've known too many wonderful ladies who have been raped, or had rape attempts on them, and I'm a survivor myself. I'll get off my soap box now and quit venting. We should write that police department ... but to be fair, a reason not an excuse, change, even to the truth, is a painful slow process, and the officer could just be plain ignorant (we all have ignorances!) and acting on his enculturation, a twisted patriarchal enculturation. But that's a reason, not an excuse. Ta-Ta For Now, David @::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: Merchant@utkvx.utk.edu University of Tennessee Celebrate DIversIty School of Information Science @:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Nov 1994 21:43:01 CST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Rebecca Hill Subject: Re: "grandstanding feminists" I agree with Daphne Patai about the problems of ideological rigidity or dogmatism in women's studies classrooms (prev. called "grandstanding feminists"). I have certainly experienced pressures in feminist classrooms that had to do with people trying to be "more feminist than thou." This seems to happen in two ways. The first is the enforcement of what bell hooks calls "nice-nice" behavior, or the critiquing of other women for being too "male-identified"(I've gotten attacked for this one as have other Jewish women I know). I see it as a real problem in a feminism that acknowledges the diversity of genders in theory, but not in practice. The second type of dogmatism/ideological enforcement has to do with more aggressive student behavior which I associate with undergraduates who have recently "converted" to feminism in women's studies courses. I have less of an idea about what to do about this problem pedagogically, because on the one hand I feel sort of nostalgically indulgent of it, but on the other I find it tiresome at best and abusive at worst. I didn't take any women's studies courses as an undergraduate because I wanted to avoid discussions dominated by people like this. This kind of behavior is annoying to people who have been feminists for a while, and alienating for people who are entirely new to feminism. Yuck! It's a really difficult pedagogical question, because you want to encourage participation, not silence it, but dogmatic students are, as Patai pointed out, capable of silencing other women, alienating them from women's studies as a discipline, and from feminism as a politics. Is this phenomenon peculiar to women's studies or does it happen in other places as well? Sorry to go on for so long.-Rebecca Hill ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Nov 1994 22:55:06 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List Comments: Warning -- RSCS tag indicates an origin of $SMTPSRV@UMDD From: Michele Forte Subject: Labels Hello all. A student in a WSS class I teach came to my offcie hours recently with a question about an assignment. She is an articulate woman and relayed a few conversations with her boyfriend during which she has challenged what she feels to be closed-minded and misogynist attitudes. She ended the conversation by sort of backing out of my ofice, explaining that she "wasn't a feminist or anything," but just didn't like his attitude. Of course, I seized the oppor- tunity to ask why she wasn't "one," why she didn't want to be one, etc. She said that she didn't want people to think she hated men, and never got much clearer on her reasons. This month's MS features an article which wonders the same thing ("Fear of Feminism"). Since this is not the first time I have heard this, I was wondering if anyone else had expereinced this same reaction and whatthe reasons are, how you all have reponded, etc. I am sure the media is to thank for a lot, but backlash is so insidious that it's hard to keep track at times. Looking forward to your responses. Cheers, Michele Forte mf7175@cnsvax.albany.edu ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Nov 1994 23:28:56 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Joan Korenman Subject: Old Files and New Michele Forte's recent message asking about "fear of feminism" gives me an opportunity to announce that I have added three new files to the WMST-L collection, and to inform/remind people about the existence of an older file, FEMINIST LABEL, that deals with the issue Michele raises. The three new files, all compilations of messages that originally appeared on WMST-L, are the following: 1) ACADEMIC SEARCH - Advice about the academic search process and about applying for an academic job 2) FARRELL WHOIS - Discussion of Warren Farrell, author of _The Myth of Male Power_, with some suggestions for men who write about men's issues from a more feminist perspective 3) SOMMERS DISCUSS1 (that's a number 1 at the end of DISCUSS) - discussion of Christina Hoff Sommers' _Who Stole Feminism_, including mention of some published critiques of Sommers' work. To get all four files, send the following four-line message to LISTSERV@UMDD.UMD.EDU or, if you're on Bitnet, LISTSERV@UMDD: GET FEMINIST LABEL GET ACADEMIC SEARCH GET FARRELL WHOIS GET SOMMERS DISCUSS1 Not long ago, someone sent a message to WMST-L claiming that the "correct" way to request a file was to include WMST-L at the end of the filename, as in GET FEMINIST LABEL WMST-L. Normally, adding WMST-L is optional, not required. If you're sending the message to LISTSERV's Bitnet address, adding F=MAIL at the end of each line will guarantee that the file will arrive as an email message rather than as a file that you have to "receive." E.g., GET FARRELL WHOIS F=MAIL . Files sent to Internet addresses automatically get sent as mail messages. If you want to find out what other files are available (a good thing to do before sending queries to the list), add one more line that contains the two words INDEX WMST-L . BE SURE TO SEND THESE MESSAGES TO LISTSERV, not to WMST-L! Joan Korenman Internet: korenman@umbc2.umbc.edu Bitnet: korenman@umbc ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Nov 1994 11:20:31 GMT Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: madeleine gilkes Subject: Chilean women under Pinochet's dictatorship Hi! I was wondering if anyone can help me! I want to carry out research on Chilean women and their treatment under the military dictatorship for my M.A. but I'm having problems in producing an extensive and up-to-date bibliography. I am interested in the roles which women played under the dictatorship, their treatment and how this contrasted with cultural norms and expectations. Thank you, Madeleine Gilkes University of York, England mg102@york.ac.uk ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Nov 1994 07:12:52 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Dennis Fischman Subject: safe space in the classroom I don't know exactly what to think about this issue. I have to agree with the folks who have stressed that controversy is a part of any good classroom, espeecially a feminist classroom. Most of the postings, however, seem to me to ignore real concerns, some of which are classic feminist issues. 1) Sometimes, demanding reasons for a belief can be a form of intellectual bullying. This is true when a student is trying to formulate an idea for the first time, perhaps making sense of her experience in a new way. Other students or the teacher can stifle her thought processes by insisting that either she give reasons, provide evidence, cite authorities, answer counter-arguments, and so on, or abandon her fledgling belief. Women have found themselves particularly vulnerable to this kind of silencing in the past (see the work of Robin Lakoff). Without having to agree with them, necessarily, how do we nurture new insights on those personal matters that feminists have rightly diagnosed as political? 2) Many of our students have histories of abuse of various kinds. (When I say "many," the psych lit says up to half.) Most have not fully come to terms with their experience. What would be safe in the abstract for a detached, rational subject is not safe for real people. Can we demand that our students act out an Enlightenment fantasy of reason in order to be accepted in our classrooms? On the other hand, how much care can we provide when we typically don't know our students personally and we have courses to teach, regardless? I'm not claiming there are any easy answers, but it seems to me that teaching *about* feminist theories of domination and then ignoring instances of domination in front of our eyes is sending exactly the wrong message to our students. Dennis Fischman dfischmn@acs.bu.edu (617) 776-4701 home (617) 353-2907 work "Ph.D. in changing the world" ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Nov 1994 08:39:31 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Ilene Lieberman Subject: request for film name Could anyone tell me the name of the recently released film, directed by an Asian woman living in the U.K.? The film is about a group of women from a women's center who take a day trip to the seaside resort of Brighton. Ilene Lieberman@cyber.widener.edu ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Nov 1994 10:20:55 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: DAPHNE PATAI Subject: man-hating In-Reply-To: <199411050400.XAA11667@holmes.umd.edu> from "Michele Forte" at Nov 4, 94 10:55:06 pm Responding to Michele's experience of a student for whom "feminist" translates into "man-hater," I am sorry to have to say that I do not believe this is an "image" problem perpetrated on us by the media. As a professor in women's studies, I have certainly witnessed such attitudes freely expressed in women's studies circles, writings, meetings, public lectures, and classes by BOTH faculty and students. I believe this (and the general censoriousness of many feminists toward other women, about which I sent an earlier posting) is a serious problem that many feminists have been unwilling to acknowledge and to address. We seem to embrace the "authority of experience" only when it confirms what we already believe to be true. When, for example, students (and others) tell us of their negative impressions of feminism, too many of us tend to dismiss that as "backlash" or media hype. This is extremely unfortunate--and worse: detrimental to feminism in the long run. Noretta Koertge and I have written about this and other problems in women's studies in our new book, "Professing Feminism: Cautionary Tales from the Strange World of Women's Studies." We also describe the ways in which many women's studies people promote anger (we call it "angercult"), and thus help to fixate their students at one particular stage of development of a feminist consciousness, and we feel strongly that it is not the mission of an educational institution to foster such attitudes. Let me say that our work is based not only on our own experiences but on interviews with other women who have devoted years to women's studies and have gotten quite disillusioned at what they have encountered. We don't see how the situation can change, or improve, as long as there continues to be massive denial that there IS a problem in many (we don't, of course, claim ALL) programs. -- ====================== Daphne.Patai@spanport.umass.edu ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Nov 1994 10:54:59 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Cindy Bily Subject: women and sentencing Picking up an earlier thread about differences in sentencing men and women who have killed their partners: There is a fine film by Carol Jacobsen called FROM ONE PRISON, in which she interviews six women serving time in Michigan for killing their abusive partners. I don't remember the stats, but the women have each received much longer sentences than men found guilty of "comparable" crimes. The point of the film (and of the women) is not that they should be excused for killing, but that their sentences are inequitable--and that the services (training, etc) for women prisoners are much inferior to those offered men in prison. The price is $50 for purchase, $20 for rental or $150 for public screening. To order, contact Carol Jacobsen at 313-662-0776 (phone or fax). There will be a free public screening at Wayne State University Dept of Art on December 8, 1994-- 7:00 p.m. in Helen Deroy Aud. --Cindy Bily Adrian College cbily@adrian.edu ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Nov 1994 11:23:18 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Sherry Linkon Subject: Re: "grandstanding feminists" In-Reply-To: <199411050307.AA20878@UNIX1.CC.YSU.EDU> Rebecca Hill asked whether the problem of "grandstanding" occurs in other kinds of courses, and I would say absolutely. I think that's what makes me uneasy about Daphne's aiming this at feminists. I've seen students and teachers of all political persuasions grandstand. It's the behavior not the politics that is the source of the problem. Feminist may be just as prone to this as other human beings, even if we intellectually see such behavior as inappropriate -- sometimes the personal isn't political -- it's just personality. Ideally, we would all translate our ideals into action, but we're not perfect. We are also passionate, and that sometimes leads to grandstanding -- and again, I think all kinds of people are capable of it. Sherry Linkon ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Nov 1994 10:27:48 CST6CDT Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Kim Cook Subject: Helen Susan Edelman this is for Helen Susan Edelman: I tried towrite to you personally, but the address you provided did not work. Please contact me, re: Abortion research. I wrote my dissertation on Abortion and would like to chat with youabout your project. Thanks, Kimberly J. Cook cook@soc.msstate.edu kjcook@ra.msstate.edu ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Nov 1994 10:55:44 -0600 Reply-To: greta gaard Sender: Women's Studies List From: greta gaard Subject: Re: request for film name In message <199411051337.HAA19020@ub.d.umn.edu> "Women's Studies List" writes: > Could anyone tell me the name of the recently released film, directed by an > Asian woman living in the U.K.? The film is about a group of women from a > women's center who take a day trip to the seaside resort of Brighton. > Ilene Lieberman@cyber.widener.edu The film is called "Bhaji on the Beach" by Gurinder Chadha. I saw it at the UPTOWN theatre in Minneapolis and still have the flyer if you need a plot summary about it. Greta Gaard University of Minnesota, Duluth ggaard@d.umn.edu ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Nov 1994 11:54:37 EST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: "Alesandra.Schmidt" Subject: Exhibition of 19th-century American women's magazines ANNOUNCMENT OF EXHIBITION: "Designed for the Ladies: Nineteenth-Century American Women's Magazines" is on view now through 31 January 1995 at the Watkinson Library of Trinity College in Hartford, Connecticut. On display are nearly eighty magazines, books, newspapers, and manuscripts illustrating the development and significance of the periodical press for women readers and women writers in America in the 1800s. Among the many magazines shown are the first issue of "The Lady's Magazine and Repository of Entertaining Knowledge" (published in Philadelphia in 1792), "Godey's Lady's Book," "Peterson's Magazine," "The Ladies' Companion," "Lowell Offering," "The New England Kitchen Magazine," and "Harper's Bazar" [sic]. Two volumes of "The New York Ledger," an important newspaper of which the Watkinson Library has the longest known run, are opened to "Fresh Fern Leaves" by Fanny Fern, one of the first women newspaper columnists in America. Four women writers with local and regional associations are profiled--Sarah Josepha Hale, Lydia Howard Sigourney, Fanny Fern (Sara Payson Willis Parton), and Harriet Beecher Stowe. Also featured in the exhibition are examples of magazine "how-to" advice on domestic subjects. The Watkinson Library is open 9:30-4:30, Monday-Saturday, when classes are in session. (The Library will be closed from noon on November 23 through November 27, and from noon on December 23 through January 2. Please call for information about Saturday hours in January.) Open to the public, admission free. Exhibition tours can be arranged. An exhibition catalog is available at no charge. TO REQUEST AN EXHIBITION CATALOG, OR FOR MORE INFORMATION, PLEASE E-MAIL OR CALL: Alesandra M.Schmidt, Assistant Curator for Reference and Manuscripts, The Watkinson Library, Trinity College. Phone: 203-297-2267; e-mail address, alesandra.schmidt@mail.trincoll.edu Alesandra M. Schmidt, Watkinson Library, Trinity College, Hartford, CT 06106 Alesandra.Schmidt@mail.trincoll.edu (203) 297-2267 ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Nov 1994 09:20:56 -0800 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Carolyn Austin Subject: Re: Labels In-Reply-To: <199411050400.XAA11667@holmes.umd.edu> Michele Forte's message hit home. I've been teaching a composition class that focuses on a major research project of the students' choosing for the last couple of years. Over and over again, I have students choose feminist topics -- childcare for working mothers, representations of women in the media, exploitation a female illegal immigrants, etc. But they almost invariably include the phrase "I'm not a feminist, but. . ." in their oral presentations at the end of the quarter. I never know how to counter this. I had always hoped that my avowal of feminism (and I think I'm a pretty balanced human being -- at least in the classroom) would show my students that feminists are only rabid when called for (there are situations in which we should be damn angry!). Any thoughts on how to counter fear of feminism? Carolyn Austin Graduate Student, Department of English and Comparative Literature University of California, Irvine eahg436@ea.oac.uci.edu ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Nov 1994 12:35:09 EST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List Comments: Converted from OfficeVision to RFC822 by PUMP V2.2X From: "Linda Lopez McAlister, SWIP-L Moderator" Subject: FILM REVIEW ADDED: I Don't Want To Talk about It(De Eso No Se Hab On Saturday, November 5, I reviewed "I Don't Want To Talk About It" (De Eso No Se Habla) on "The Women's Show" now celebrating its fifteenth anniversary on community radio station WMNF-FM (88.5) in Tampa, Florida. It is now available for retrieval from the FILM FILELIST. To obtain this review send the following command to Listserv @UMDD (Bitnet) or UMDD.UMD.EDU (Internet): GET FILM REV125 FILM To obtain a list of all the film reviews available, send a message to the same listserv address that says: INDEX FILM To get more than one review, put each command on a separate line: GET FILM REV6 FILM GET FILM REV14 FILM GET FILM REV39 FILM The opinions expressed in these reviews were mine when I wrote the review and represent one woman's opinion at a particular time.We have over 3000 subscribers to WMST-L so there are probably 2999 other views. If you would like to share yours, please do NOT do so on the WMST-L itself, but send your messages to me personally at the addresses below. I have appreciated the feedback I've received. Thanks. Linda ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Nov 1994 12:39:57 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Ranita Chatterjee Subject: Re: request for film name In-Reply-To: <9411051533.AA11853@bosshog.arts.uwo.ca> On Sat, 5 Nov 1994, Ilene Lieberman wrote: > Could anyone tell me the name of the recently released film, directed by an > Asian woman living in the U.K.? The film is about a group of women from a > women's center who take a day trip to the seaside resort of Brighton. > Ilene Lieberman@cyber.widener.edu > The director's name is Gurinder Chadha and her film is _Bhaji on the Beach_. It's an excellent film that I highly recommend. Also it's important to remember that Chadha is a _British_ woman of South Asian descent and NOT an "Asian woman living in the U.K." The film itself is very British and should be read in the context of the British film industry and not seen as an "Asian" film (whatever that is!). By the way, the women take a day trip to Blackpool. Please don't read the above as a flame. I've been doing some work on this film and other so-called postcolonial films and am quite frustrated with the ignorance of the various reviews I've read of this film. This is not meant to criticize the poster who asked the question. I would be interested in getting more reactions to this film from people on this net. R Ranita Chatterjee Department of English University of Western Ontario London, Ontario, Canada N6A 3K7 ranitac@bosshog.arts.uwo.ca ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Nov 1994 12:52:13 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Joan Korenman Subject: Helen Edelman's address Recently, Kim Cook sent a message to WMST-L because she couldn't get through privately to the address Helen Edelman provided in her earlier message. The problem, I think, is that Helen included in%" before her address and a " after it. That's the way SHE and some other VAX/VMS users have to address mail, but that's not part of her address. Her address is he4801@cnsvax.albany.edu . Any time you see prefixes like in%" or smtp%" or others, please realize that they are NOT part of the email address. Just ignore them. Don't type them or the quotation marks. And please--when you send a message to WMST-L, even if you don't expect a reply but ESPECIALLY when you do--please INCLUDE your EMAIL ADDRESS at the end of the message. Helen did that, but others who have sent queries to the list in recent days have not. See section one of the User's Guide for more information. Joan Korenman Internet: korenman@umbc2.umbc.edu Bitnet: korenman@umbc ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Nov 1994 13:07:52 EST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Diane Miller Subject: Re: request for film name In-Reply-To: Message of Sat, 5 Nov 1994 08:39:31 -0500 from I think the film you're thinking of is BHAJI ON THE BEACH, though I don't know the name of the director. Diane Miller Dept. of Speech Communication University of Georgia Athens, GA 30605 ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Nov 1994 11:48:23 -0700 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: jaclark Subject: Text ideas: Psychology of gender I am seeking suggestions for texts, films, videos, etc. for an undergraduate psychology of gender course. The course is part of a women's studies minor offered for business majors. We are currently using HALF THE HUMAN EXPERIENCE: THE PSYCHOLOGY OF WOMEN by Janet Shibley Hyde. The course attracts both men and women students and we would like to offer a more balanced approach to psychological gender differences. -Anne ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Nov 1994 14:58:00 PST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Mollie Whalen Subject: Where is Anzaldua Does anyone know where to contact Gloria Anzaldua and/or Cherrie Moraga? Please reply privately to : MWHALEN@PO-BOX.ESU.EDU Thanks. ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Nov 1994 15:12:00 EDT Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Joan Korenman Subject: More About WMST-L Files > How can one access INDEX WMST-L. Thanks I'm replying to the list because there seems to be confusion on more than one person's part about WMST-L files and the message I sent yesterday about the new files that I'd added. First (in reply to a message I received privately--which is where messages like the above should also have been sent), the three new files that I added were files, not email lists. If you want to get only one of the files, say, SOMMERS DISCUSS1, but not the others, just ask for that one. Send a one-line message to LISTSERV@UMDD.UMD.EDU that says GET SOMMERS DISCUSS1 . As for INDEX WMST-L, that's a command, not a file. One can't access INDEX WMST-L; instead, one uses that command to access the WMST-L FILELIST, which lists all the WMST-L files. If you send the two-word message INDEX WMST-L to LISTSERV@UMDD.UMD.EDU, you'll be sent the WMST-L FILELIST. By the way, syllabi and film reviews are not included in the WMST-L FILELIST; they have separate filelists. If you send the message INDEX SYLLABI to the same listserv address, you'll get the SYLLABI FILELIST, which contains syllabi from about 90 Women's Studies courses, ranging from multiple syllabi for Intro and Feminist Theory courses to WS courses in political science, philosophy, psychology, history, literature, anthropology, etc. etc. The procedure for accessing these syllabi is the same as for other files--you just send the command GET [filename] to LISTSERV@UMDD.UMD.EDU, replacing [filename] with the name of the syllabus file that you want. E.g., GET ASIAN ARAB_LIT will get you the syllabus for Lisa Majaj's course on Asian American and Arab American Women's Literature, while GET MATH_AND GENDER will retrieve the revised syllabus for John Kellermeier's course entitled "Math, Gender, and Culture." And, of course, the command INDEX FILM will get you the FILM FILELIST, listing 125 feminist film reviews by Linda Lopez McAlister. Much of this information about files is also found in the Source of All Wisdom, the WMST-L User's Guide. A copy is appended to the welcome letter that is sent to all new subscribers; to get another copy, send the message GET GUIDE WMST-L to LISTSERV@UMDD.UMD.EDU. Those who can use gopher or WorldWideWeb can also read the User's Guide online. Gopher to gopher.umbc.edu and, from the main menu, select Academic Department Information (#5), then Women's Studies (#9), then WMST-L (#5). For those who use WorldWideWeb, the URL is http://www-unix.umbc.edu/~korenman/wmst/ . I hope this message proves helpful. If you have any questions, please write to me PRIVATELY, not via WMST-L. Many thanks. Joan Korenman Internet: korenman@umbc2.umbc.edu Bitnet: korenman@umbc ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Nov 1994 15:40:31 EST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List Comments: Converted from OfficeVision to RFC822 by PUMP V2.2X From: "Linda Lopez McAlister, SWIP-L Moderator" Subject: Errors in film review In the review I just posted to the film filelist "I Don't Want to Talk About It" I have made some inaccurate comments about the director Maria Luisa Bemberg (I know better than to simply reproduce the publicity materials the theater provides before I check the facts, but I didn't do it this time). I will post a revised and more accurate review shortly. It's the information I give about Maria Luisa Bemberg's life and career that's wildly wrong. Linda Linda Lopez McAlister Department of Women's Studies University of South Florida Tampa, FL 33620 (813) 974-5531 ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Nov 1994 15:41:56 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: DAPHNE PATAI Subject: the proper feminist response to criticism??? Here is a good example of why feminism is in trouble. I won't bother replying to the particulars. Daphne Forwarded message: > From mgolden@emoryu1.cc.emory.edu Sat Nov 5 14:23:49 1994 > Date: Sat, 05 Nov 1994 14:23:44 -0500 (EST) > From: "Michelle B. Golden" > Subject: Re: man-hating > In-reply-to: <9411051521.AA18208@emoryu1.cc.emory.edu> > To: DAPHNE PATAI > Message-id: > MIME-version: 1.0 > Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII > Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT > Content-length: 3334 > > Daphne, > > There was an undertone to your messages that I couldn't pin down until > this one. Now I get it--you're promoting your book! I think a friend of > yours posted about this book early on in the discussion. > > Veiled advertising, but advertising nonetheless. Would you have been so > active on this list on this subject if you didn't have a book you were > trying to sell? > > Fear not. Your book will do fine, especially because you've apparently > come up with neat new words like "angercult" (how pop psych-ish! How > trendy!). The public is looking for books that confirm this ideas that > feminism is about "man-hating". I think that rage is, for many, a part of > the process of coming to a consciousness about one's oppression. It > happens, it passes, we move on. I don't think the rage is even truly > directed toward "men." But you've written a book, so for sure you must > have a better theory that I do. > > And yes, i am angry (at you not men)--mainly because the net is not the > place to promote one's book. (I have the feeling you may be thinking, > "censorship!" because maybe you think that ideas as "threatening to > feminism" as yours are are subject to feminist censorship. Get over it. > I'm not interested in "censoring" your book--I just don't want it > promoted on the non-commercial net). > > Michelle > > On Sat, 5 Nov 1994, DAPHNE PATAI wrote: > > > Responding to Michele's experience of a student for whom "feminist" > > translates into "man-hater," I am sorry to have to say that I do not > > believe this is an "image" problem perpetrated on us by the media. As > > a professor in women's studies, I have certainly witnessed such > > attitudes freely expressed in women's studies circles, writings, > > meetings, public lectures, and classes by BOTH faculty and students. > > I believe this (and the general censoriousness of many feminists > > toward other women, about which I sent an earlier posting) is > > a serious problem that many feminists have been unwilling to acknowledge > > and to address. We seem to embrace the "authority of experience" only > > when it confirms what we already believe to be true. When, for example, > > students (and others) tell us of their negative impressions of > > feminism, too many of us tend to dismiss that as "backlash" or media > > hype. This is extremely unfortunate--and worse: detrimental to > > feminism in the long run. Noretta Koertge and I have written about > > this and other problems in women's studies in our new book, > > "Professing Feminism: Cautionary Tales from the Strange World of > > Women's Studies." We also describe the ways in which many women's > > studies people promote anger (we call it "angercult"), and thus help > > to fixate their students at one particular stage of development of a > > feminist consciousness, and we feel strongly that it is not the > > mission of an educational institution to foster such attitudes. Let > > me say that our work is based not only on our own experiences but on > > interviews with other women who have devoted years to women's > > studies and have gotten quite disillusioned at what they have > > encountered. We don't see how the situation can change, or improve, > > as long as there continues to be massive denial that there IS a > > problem in many (we don't, of course, claim ALL) programs. > > -- > > ====================== > > Daphne.Patai@spanport.umass.edu > > > -- ====================== Daphne.Patai@spanport.umass.edu ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Nov 1994 13:24:20 -0800 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Wendy Stock Subject: Tisdale cite search I'm trying to locate a magazine article by ?.Tisdale, the author of the new book, "Talk Dirty To Me". I know it was published in the past year in Mother Jones, Lears, or some popular mag. Anyone know the cite? Please respond privately: wendyst@itsa.ucsf.edu Thanks- Wendy Stock Pacific Graduate School of Psychology ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Nov 1994 16:39:34 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Joan Korenman Subject: Re: the proper feminist response to criticism??? All my sensible instincts tell me that I should stay out of this, at least for the moment, but the message Daphne Patai has fowarded to the list should, I think, be addressed, lest it leave people with misconceptions both about Daphne and about messages appropriate for WMST-L. The writer of the message asks Daphne "would you have been so active on this list on this subject if you didn't have a book you were trying to sell?" I wish to point out that Daphne Patai has been active on this and other lists for several years, and has written critically about feminism and Women's Studies for years, not just now that she has a book to promote. (See, for example, her 1992 essay in the _Chronicle of Higher Education_, "The Struggle for Feminist Purity Threatens Goals of Feminism," which is also available from the WMST-L filelist under the filename FEMINIST PURITY.) I don't agree with everything Daphne has said, but she writes as a feminist and as someone who has been involved for years with Women's Studies. I also want to make it clear that WMST-L is most assuredly an appropriate place for people to let their WS colleagues know about the books they have written on Women's Studies topics. Others have done so in the past, and I hope people will not hesitate to do so in the future. Joan Korenman Internet: korenman@umbc2.umbc.edu Bitnet: korenman@umbc ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Nov 1994 16:55:00 EDT Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Joan Korenman Subject: 3 new email lists I have received information recently about three new lists that may be of interest to WMST-L readers: 1) CITNET-W - Healthy Cities Women's Network 2) XXANDLAW - Email List for Women Law Students 3) TCC-L - Teaching in Community Colleges For more information, please contact the people named in the announcements, not WMST-L or me. Joan Korenman ************************************************************************ 1) CITNET-W, the Healthy Cities Women's Network, is a list for people interested in women's health issues and healthy cities issues. Send subscription messages to LISTSERV@INDYCMS.IUPUI.EDU (Internet) or LISTSERV@INDYCMS (Bitnet). Beverly Flynn (citynet@indyvax.bitnet) ************************************************************************** 2) I'm very pleased to announce the creation of an email discussion list for women law students. To subscribe, please send email to owner-XXandLaw@law.wisc.edu. Include your name and email address. This list is open to women only. You will get information informing you that you have been added. To post, send your message to XXandLaw@law.wisc.edu The purpose of this list is to provide a forum for discussion of our status as "outsiders" in legal culture. For this reason, we especially encourage women of color, women with disabilities, women in their second careers, lesbian or bisexual women, and feminist women to participate in this dialogue. Discussion on any subject of concern to women in the law is welcome -- if you wonder if our thoughts are appropriate, they probably are! We want to encourage dialogue, including disagreement with one another, in a respectful environment. Please feel free to forward this message to any women you think would be interested in such a forum. If you have any questions, feel free to contact me. --Liza Kessler ekessler@students.wisc.edu ************************************************************************** 3) TCC-L on LISTSERV@UHccVM.bitnet Teaching In The Community Colleges or LISTSERV@UHccVM.UHcc.Hawaii.Edu TCC-L is an electronic forum for community college teachers. Topics for discussions and announcements should be related to instruction: trends, issues, strategies, resources, etc. Please share problems that you face in the classroom or concerns that touch on the classroom experience. Share successful activities, assignments, or lessons. The intended mood is a friendly workshop atmosphere that is short on judgment and long on encouragement. Each month, a discussion question or theme will be posted. For example, for November 1994, the question is: Is workload an issue on your campus, and what are you doing about it? To subscribe, send the following one-line message to LISTSERV@UHccVM.bitnet or LISTSERV@UHccVM.UHcc.Hawaii.Edu sub TCC-L YourFirstName YourLastName After subscribing to the list, please post your responses or comments to the entire group. To do so, send email to: TCC-L@UHccVM.bitnet or TCC-L@UHccVM.UHcc.Hawaii.Edu Your messages shouldn't be limited to the question of the month. Also, if you have suggestions for the next question of the month, please send them to me, Jim, at JamesS@UHunix.UHcc.Hawaii.edu In the planning stages is the Teaching in the Community Colleges Journal, a newsletter. If you're interested in participating in this effort, please write to me, Jim (see Owner). Hope to see you in the "workroom." Owner: Jim Shimabukuro JamesS@UHunix.UHcc.Hawaii.edu University of Hawaii - Kapiolani CC ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Nov 1994 18:17:00 EST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: LAURA KRAMER Subject: strongly recommend bhaji on the beach Hi, I saw this film last spring, and thought it was terrific. I also thought it would be wonderful for use in conjunction with many different courses in sociology (my field). It's about family, gender, social change, violence, age, ethnicity, ... I don't think it is yet available on video, but I doubt it will take long to get there. Laura kramer@apollo.montclair.edu p.s. definitely good for an intro to women's studies course, and probably lots of other courses, too - i've only considered it for courses i teach (obviously). ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Nov 1994 17:38:48 -0600 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Miriam Harris Subject: Re: the proper feminist response to criticism??? In-Reply-To: <199411052043.PAA22174@holmes.umd.edu> Daphne, You were brave to share such a venemous attack. How sad to think anyone would write such a thing. Miriam Harris ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Nov 1994 14:35:00 EST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: GENGLER Subject: Re: man-hating In response to the label "man-hater" - I, as a young (26) "out" feminist, have been called that on numerous occasions (ex: "Yeah, but you're a man-hater"). While I am sure that this label can be damaging, I do realize that this is a defense that people use (mostly men, in my case) to somehow write off whatever it is that I'm saying at the time - then they don't have to listen. I find this is the same as calling someone "PC". That way - whatever the person is saying can be dismissed as someone following some sort of trend rather than taking the time for a discussion on an adult level and engaging in intelligent debate. I look forward also to reading the article in Ms. about women my age and their fear of being labeled feminists because it will lower the number of men that will be available to them. From my experience, this seems to be the case, but I look at it in a positive way - a weeding out process of closed-minded, archaic-thinking, insecure men. I hope this was an appropriate posting for the entire list - this is my first posting to WMST-L. Greta Englert gengler@smtpgate.phc.com ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Nov 1994 16:14:17 -0800 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Susan Ervin-Tripp Subject: journals The mention of journals in one of the comments about the classroom as a safe place was brought up to suggest that journals are private and protected from the commentary of other students. However, if they are required they are invasive of student privacy. This issue came to my attention in a case in my department when a visiting instructor in a sexuality class required journals. A student who felt it was an invasion of privacy refused and was given a much heavier assignment, and so she complained to the department chair who treated it as a matter of the instructor's academic freedom. I think journals are widely used now in teaching, and so I wonder about what is appropriate to suggest about such cases. Susan Ervin-Tripp Psychology University of California, Berkeley ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Nov 1994 20:19:52 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Amy Goodle Subject: LesAc: new address (x-posted) CHEERS TO DAVID CASTI & CO.!!!! LesAc has now become a "real" mailing list... Now I can go back to having a REAL life!! :) If you'd like to subscribe to the LesAc list, please follow these new directions: Send the message: subscribe lesac to this address: majordomo@vector.casti.com To unsubscribe, send the message: unsubscribe lesac to the same address. The LesAc list is open to lesbian and bisexual women who are graduate students or faculty members; MTF lesbian or bi identified transexual academics are also welcome to join. If you do not fall into these categories but would still like to join, send a note explaining your situation to: lesac-approval@vector.casti.com and I'll make a decision. All other personal inquiries can be sent to LezScholar@aol. -- Amy Goodloe ::::::wiping the sweat from her brow::::::: LezScholar@aol.com ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 6 Nov 1994 16:09:35 +1300 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Prue Hyman Subject: Re: NWSA - Jewish Caucus mharris@UTDALLAS.EDU Miriam Harris is the Jewish Caucus coordinator Prue Hyman, Economics Victoria University of Wellington PO Box 600, Wellington, New Zealand PH: (0064) 4 4955026 (or 4721000 ext 5026) FAX: (0064) 4 4712200 e-mail address: Prue.Hyman@vuw.ac.nz (or HymanP@Matai.vuw.ac.nz) ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Nov 1994 22:02:35 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Michele Forte Subject: Re: man-hating In response to my original posting and the subsequent responses (I hope to read more): I have had a chance to re-read the article I referred to in MS (authores by the way, by Lisa Marie Hogeland who teaches English and WSS at the Univers ityof Cincinnati), and I sti ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Nov 1994 22:17:56 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Michele Forte Subject: Re: man-hating Sorry about that last posting; it was mistakenly sent. Anyway, I want to add about the MS article i referred to in my original posting-- I think the author (Lisa marie Hogeland) makes a useful distinction between "gender consciousness" (i.e., the awareness that men and women have different experiences) and feminism (the politicization of these differences coupled with an awareness of the many contradictions we each live every day). It is extremely helpful for me to have this clear in my mind, as I often assume that because feminist principles make sense to me, that indeed everyone is a feminist and just might not "know." In fact, this article reminds me of how much is at stake for many women when this declaration is made. I am still curious to read other people's experiences with this reluctance to claim feminism as a part of one's identity. I am also curious to read the ideas explore in Daphne's book; it seems as though we are at a cross-roads as a discipline and there is a great deal of tension in deparments as they become part of the University (and all that this may imply). Thank you all for your wonderful responses do far! michele forte mf7175@cnsvax.albany.edu ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Nov 1994 22:47:00 EDT Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Nancy Goldstein Subject: "Grandstanding Feminists" Gee whiz. Even though I've taught at three New England institutions in the past decade (Brandeis University, Harvard University, and Connecticut College), I don't think I've encountered the problem of students silencing other students by being too ardently feminist, though I've certainly encountered my share of students who smoulder passively-aggressively and cast themselves as victims of oppression when they find themselves unwilling and/or unable to counter the views and/or arguments of other students and/or professors whose views "make them" uncomfortable. Perhaps "grandstanding feminists" simply aren't indigenous to this part of the country. It's hard to tell since no one has named names in this Rush Limbaugh- inflected (as in "feminazi") thread. Anyway, could someone please tell me how to order a few of these beasts so I could show them to my students in the flesh? Grandstands included, please. On a less arch note, I wonder if it would be possible to call people of color whose "ideological rigidness" or "dogmatism" frightened one "grandstanding people of color," or is this kind of insult/accusation possible only when one is referring to women? Grrr. Woof! Nancy Goldstein goldstein@binah.cc.brandeis.edu ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Nov 1994 23:41:16 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Zoya Fansler Subject: Re: Tisdale cite search Believe it or not, Tisdale's book is excerpted in the current issue of _Vogue_. (That's November's edition.) Zoya Fansler ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 6 Nov 1994 09:29:32 EST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Jo Ellen Green Kaiser Subject: Re: journals In-Reply-To: Message of Sat, 5 Nov 1994 16:14:17 -0800 from Susan Ervin-Tripp asked whether journals might be invasive. I don't teach courses which center heavily on personal experience, but I do require frequent written responses to our reading. My guess is that as long as the student is asked to respond to course material, required journals are fine-- students can simply evaluate the author, or they can relate personal exp.-- their choice. I think we cannot ask students to discuss their personal lives if we insist on reading such responses, and what's worse, grading them. Jo Ellen Green Kaiser jgkais00@ukcc.uky.edu U. Kentucky ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 6 Nov 1994 10:00:26 EST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Rosa Maria Pegueros Subject: Re: "Grandstanding Feminists" In-Reply-To: Message of Sat, 5 Nov 1994 22:47:00 EDT from Grandstanding people of color? Hey, wait a minute. Is this a Freudian slip? Is this what you really feel about people of color expressing their anger at their maltreatment? How about keeping the focus of the argument where it belongs?? Rosa Maria Pegueros ....................................................................... Rosa Maria Pegueros e-mail: pegueros@uriacc.uri.edu Department of History telephone: (401) 792-4092 217C Washburn Hall University of Rhode Island Kingston, RI 02881-0817 "Women hold up half the sky." ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 6 Nov 1994 10:24:38 EST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Rosa Maria Pegueros Subject: Grandstanding Feminists Like Joan, I was going to stay out of this one, but things are heating up and so I wanted to say something to set this debate in perspective. I think that we should go back to our corners and let elevated blood- pressures drop, and think about this. I don't know Daphne Patai personally although I have read her work and used one of her books in my teaching. But what I know OF her, from reading this list for a few years and reading her books, is that she is a thoughtful person who apparently, in her new book, is grappling with the difficult task of offering CONSTRUCTIVE criticism of our field, not to be lumped with Chris- tina Hoff Sommers. I realize that I may be wrong, but I think that a person's past record of accomplishment merits careful consideration of her work. We must be careful to distinguish between outsiders, anti-feminists, and misogyn- ists who hate what we are doing in raising the mass consciousness of society to the abuses of women, the violations of our civil rights, and the long his- tory of keeping women in a second-class position in society, and those from our own ranks who are casting a critical but loving eye at our discipline and challenging us to do it better. Every movement has extremists. I believe it was W.H. Auden who said that we need orthodoxy. Women's studies grew out of a political movement and among those movement activists are indeed man-haters, and separatists, just as there are members of Supreme Courts (like Ruth Bader Ginzburg whose early work on sex-based discrimination changed the nature of women's work, and former Calfornia Supreme Court justice Rose Bird) who may appear to be too conserva- tive for us today, but whose ground-breaking work changed our lives. I think that rather than battening down the hatches and torpedoing anyone who criticizes women's studies, we recognize that we are now an institution: Some of us do our work well, and others, poorly. Some of us take out our ag- gressions on our students, and some rule the women's studies program with an iron hand. And while some of us come to women's studies from a position of strength, others think of themselves as victims and teach it that way. To paraphrase Walt Whitman, "Do I contradict myself? Very well, then, I contra- dict myself: I am large, I contain multitudes." Rosa Maria Pegueros ....................................................................... Rosa Maria Pegueros e-mail: pegueros@uriacc.uri.edu Department of History telephone: (401) 792-4092 217C Washburn Hall University of Rhode Island Kingston, RI 02881-0817 "Women hold up half the sky." ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 6 Nov 1994 10:51:11 EST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Rosie Subject: Re: LesAc: new address (x-posted) In-Reply-To: Message of Sat, 5 Nov 1994 20:19:52 -0500 from Is this the one that I should have gotten that if I get it, I don't subscribe anew because I'm already subscribed?? Rosie ....................................................................... Rosa Maria Pegueros e-mail: pegueros@uriacc.uri.edu Department of History telephone: (401) 792-4092 217C Washburn Hall University of Rhode Island Kingston, RI 02881-0817 "Women hold up half the sky." ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 6 Nov 1994 11:57:26 EDT Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Lynne Taetzsch Subject: MINDING THE BODY: new book Since Joan said it was OK to post infor about books: MINDING THE BODY: Women Writers on Body and Soul, ed. by Patricia Foster, Anchor/Doubleday, May, 1994, $21.95. Contributors include Pam Houston, Sallie Tisdale, Margaret Atwood, Naomi Wolf, Nancy Mairs, Judith Ortiz Cofer, Janet Burroway, Linda Hogan, Lucy Grealy, and Kathryn Harrison, plus me, Lynne Taetzsch. Patricia Foster asked herself, "If I have struggled all of my life to make peac e with my body, to achieve some equilibrium between cultural expectation and re ality, am I alone, or are there other women who have felt imprisoned by culture, who have found no other way to speak except through the body?" The answer can be found in MINDING THE BODY. Lynne Taetzsch taetzsch@gwuvm.gwu.edu ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 6 Nov 1994 10:39:44 EST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Katherine Subject: Re: request for film name In-Reply-To: Message of Sat, 5 Nov 1994 08:39:31 -0500 from Ilene, The film is titled -Bajahs on the Beach-. Katherine Side klside@vm1.yorku.ca ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 6 Nov 1994 13:07:59 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: "Michelle B. Golden" Subject: Re: the proper feminist response to criticism??? In-Reply-To: <9411052043.AA21738@emoryu1.cc.emory.edu> Daphne (cc to other members of the WMST list with apologies for cluttering your inboxes), A private email message is not a post to the list. You did not have my permission to post my message publicly. While I'm not clear what the legal implications are (ie whose property private mail is), I know that there has been discussion and I also know that one sends mail at one's own risk. However, your public posting of my private message to you is absolutely unacceptable to me. I can do nothing about it, of course. I'm posting this to the list because 1. I want people to know that my response to Daphne was meant for Daphne and not the list (it was a flame of sorts) and 2. I'm interested in knowing what people think about the public posting of a private message on the net. I know that we should be careful re: what we send to anyone because someone somewhere is supposedly keeping a copy of even deleted messages and some court ruled that it is legal to use email as evidence in court, but what are the informal and legal guidelines re: posting a private message without the permission of the writer of that message? Anyone know? BTW, I stand by the substance of my message to Daphne. If feminism is in trouble because some of us object to book promotion on the net, I'm very confused. If I was wrong in thinking this was book promotion, that's one thing. But Daphne's "no comment" message and irresponsible (IMHO) post to the list doesn't really make clear to me what her objections are. I sent the message to Daphne as a semi-flame, hoping she'd get more such private messages. I didn't want to embarrass her publicly or derail an important discussion already in progress on the list. Please respond to me privately unless there's a reason to post to the list. Daphne, I'm still interested in what your objections to my message are--could you bring yourself to respond off-line, or is that not in the interest of publicity for you and your book? Michelle On Sat, 5 Nov 1994, DAPHNE PATAI wrote: > Here is a good example of why feminism is in trouble. I won't bother > replying to the particulars. Daphne > > > Forwarded message: > > From mgolden@emoryu1.cc.emory.edu Sat Nov 5 14:23:49 1994 > > Date: Sat, 05 Nov 1994 14:23:44 -0500 (EST) > > From: "Michelle B. Golden" > > Subject: Re: man-hating > > In-reply-to: <9411051521.AA18208@emoryu1.cc.emory.edu> > > To: DAPHNE PATAI > > Message-id: > > MIME-version: 1.0 > > Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII > > Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT > > Content-length: 3334 > > > > Daphne, > > > > There was an undertone to your messages that I couldn't pin down until > > this one. Now I get it--you're promoting your book! I think a friend of > > yours posted about this book early on in the discussion. > > > > Veiled advertising, but advertising nonetheless. Would you have been so > > active on this list on this subject if you didn't have a book you were > > trying to sell? > > > > Fear not. Your book will do fine, especially because you've apparently > > come up with neat new words like "angercult" (how pop psych-ish! How > > trendy!). The public is looking for books that confirm this ideas that > > feminism is about "man-hating". I think that rage is, for many, a part of > > the process of coming to a consciousness about one's oppression. It > > happens, it passes, we move on. I don't think the rage is even truly > > directed toward "men." But you've written a book, so for sure you must > > have a better theory that I do. > > > > And yes, i am angry (at you not men)--mainly because the net is not the > > place to promote one's book. (I have the feeling you may be thinking, > > "censorship!" because maybe you think that ideas as "threatening to > > feminism" as yours are are subject to feminist censorship. Get over it. > > I'm not interested in "censoring" your book--I just don't want it > > promoted on the non-commercial net). > > > > Michelle > > > > On Sat, 5 Nov 1994, DAPHNE PATAI wrote: > > > > > Responding to Michele's experience of a student for whom "feminist" > > > translates into "man-hater," I am sorry to have to say that I do not > > > believe this is an "image" problem perpetrated on us by the media. As > > > a professor in women's studies, I have certainly witnessed such > > > attitudes freely expressed in women's studies circles, writings, > > > meetings, public lectures, and classes by BOTH faculty and students. > > > I believe this (and the general censoriousness of many feminists > > > toward other women, about which I sent an earlier posting) is > > > a serious problem that many feminists have been unwilling to acknowledge > > > and to address. We seem to embrace the "authority of experience" only > > > when it confirms what we already believe to be true. When, for example, > > > students (and others) tell us of their negative impressions of > > > feminism, too many of us tend to dismiss that as "backlash" or media > > > hype. This is extremely unfortunate--and worse: detrimental to > > > feminism in the long run. Noretta Koertge and I have written about > > > this and other problems in women's studies in our new book, > > > "Professing Feminism: Cautionary Tales from the Strange World of > > > Women's Studies." We also describe the ways in which many women's > > > studies people promote anger (we call it "angercult"), and thus help > > > to fixate their students at one particular stage of development of a > > > feminist consciousness, and we feel strongly that it is not the > > > mission of an educational institution to foster such attitudes. Let > > > me say that our work is based not only on our own experiences but on > > > interviews with other women who have devoted years to women's > > > studies and have gotten quite disillusioned at what they have > > > encountered. We don't see how the situation can change, or improve, > > > as long as there continues to be massive denial that there IS a > > > problem in many (we don't, of course, claim ALL) programs. > > > -- > > > ====================== > > > Daphne.Patai@spanport.umass.edu > > > > > > > > -- > ====================== > Daphne.Patai@spanport.umass.edu > ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 6 Nov 1994 13:25:39 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: "Michelle B. Golden" Subject: one last message If anyone wants me to read a response to anything I've written. please be sure to send it to me privately. I'm unsubscribing. Thanks. Between Daphne's public post of my private message and Joan's response, I suppose I'm just not the right type of person to be involved on this list. Sorry for the intrusion. Michelle (mgolden@unix.cc.emory.edu) ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 6 Nov 1994 14:04:00 EDT Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Joan Korenman Subject: private vs. public messages I have received some private messages asking about the appropriateness of posting private email on WMST-L, and now Michelle Golden has raised the issue on the list, so I guess it's time for me to stop grading midterms and Be Listowner. Though I can understand Daphne Patai's anger and frustration at receiving Michelle's private message, I think Michelle did the right thing in sending her criticism privately, and Daphne was wrong to forward it to the list. Michelle asks about "the informal and legal guidelines re: posting a private message without the permission of the writer of that message." The legal issues are unsettled and will probably be wrangled over for years, but informal email "netiquette" holds that one should ask for the writer's permission before making private postings public, especially if those private postings contain sensitive content. Most rules have exceptions, and I can imagine a situation when public exposure of hurtful private messages might be appropriate, but I don't think this is such a situation, and I hope we never encounter one on WMST-L. Though I don't think Daphne should have forwarded Michelle's private message, I do think Daphne was right to mention her new book, co-authored with Noretta Koertge, entitled PROFESSING FEMINISM: CAUTIONARY TALES FROM THE STRANGE WORLD OF WOMEN'S STUDIES (New York: BasicBooks, 1994), ISBN 0-465-09821-5 (US$ 24.00). I have some strong reservations and disagreements with the book, but I think it raises issues that very much need to be discussed, and I would hope that some of that discussion will take place on WMST-L after people have had a chance to read the book. Joan Korenman Internet: korenman@umbc2.umbc.edu Bitnet: korenman@umbc ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 6 Nov 1994 14:23:44 EST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Rosa Maria Pegueros Subject: What's appropriate re: private mail I don't usually disagree with Joan on these sorts of matters, but in this case, I would like to offer a different point of view and ask a question. If, instead of getting that letter on e-mail, Daphne had received it in the U.S. mail, would she then be justified in bringing it to a women's studies program meeting to share with colleagues? sharing with with friends or colleagues on e-mail? Why should someone handle that kind of an attack on one's own? I think that if I had received it, I would have done the same thing. William D. Ruckelshaus, who was a Republican member of, I think Reagan's administration, once said something that I keep on my desk as a reminder: "Everything is public or potentially public. When you say something or write it imagine for a moment that you will see it on a billboard the next morning as you ride to work." I think that this is a sound warning for the electronic age. Rosie ....................................................................... Rosa Maria Pegueros e-mail: pegueros@uriacc.uri.edu Department of History telephone: (401) 792-4092 217C Washburn Hall University of Rhode Island Kingston, RI 02881-0817 "Women hold up half the sky." ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 6 Nov 1994 14:35:41 EST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Jo Ellen Green Kaiser Subject: Re: What's appropriate re: private mail In-Reply-To: Message of Sun, 6 Nov 1994 14:23:44 EST from I think Joan is right about private posts. This is a matter of courtesy and fairness, not a legal matter. If someone sends a flame to me because of what I've written to the list, that doesn't make it right for me to embarrass them in a public context. However, there is no reason why I couldn't forward the substance of their message, with a general description of the sender (in the case we are discussing, a regular subscriber, a woman, etc.) and ask for comments/help. I would only name the sender if she was a "public" person-- if Hoff Sommers flamed me, I would name her, for instance. Jo Ellen Green Kaiser jgkais00@ukcc.uky.edu ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 6 Nov 1994 15:25:28 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Joan Korenman Subject: Re: What's appropriate re: private mail Rosie Pegueros writes: > If, instead of getting that letter on e-mail, Daphne had received it in the > U.S. mail, would she then be justified in bringing it to a women's studies > program meeting to share with colleagues? sharing with with friends or > colleagues on e-mail? Why should someone handle that kind of an attack on > one's own? I am not suggestion that one needs to handle private attacks on one's own. In Daphne's case, she could have shared the message PRIVATELY with some of her friends and colleagues. Had she thought the message truly abusive, she could also have sent a copy to me as listowner. By handling the matter in this way, she would have shared the message 1) without turning a private communication into a public document that anyone can read, 2) without inadvertently but predictably increasing the mail volume on an already busy list, and 3) without diminishing the tone of courtesy and civility that WMST-L tries to maintain. In her message to the list, Jo Ellen Green Kaiser offers a different approach to this issue that accomplishes goals 1) and 3), though I don't think we should overlook the importance of the second goal, i.e., keeping the mail volume in check. (Yes, I recognize the irony of my saying this in yet another message to the list :-) ) Joan Korenman Internet: korenman@umbc2.umbc.edu Bitnet: korenman@umbc ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 6 Nov 1994 16:17:12 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: "G. Vinton Palazzolo" Subject: Re: the proper feminist response to criticism??? In-Reply-To: <199411061810.NAA04206@holmes.umd.edu> Michelle: Althouth I respect Joan Korenman, she does not speak for everyone on this list. I think that Patai's posting of your private message was reprehensible. It is inappropriate for the list moderator to respond publicly to the content of such a message. Patai is rather presumptuous to claim to know the proper feminist response to crticism. She does not speak for this feminist. If feminism is "in trouble", it is not from man-hating phantoms. grace *-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* When responding to mail, please use full address below, regardless of what is in the "From" heading: gvp1@crux2.cit.cornell.edu When you go, you can't take it with you. *-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 6 Nov 1994 16:34:16 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Oliver Garfield Subject: Re: What's appropriate re: private mail In-Reply-To: <199411062026.PAA06511@holmes.umd.edu> If it is the strict policy of a list to discourage advertisements then why should this policy be interrupted merely because the list owner likes the book or considers it important. Perhaps a better policy would be to review books in the field and in the review give the particulars of how to buy them. Many people now use imagined correspondence to mention their products or services or books on lists. I think list owners review books in a more systematic way than they now do because books are important vehicles for information and ideas whose distribution I see as the major function of the Internet. Oliver Garfield *********************************************************************** *Oliver Garfield email: oliver@panix.com * *World Health Foundation phone: 212-877-4230 * *125 Riverside Drive * *New York, NY 10024 * * * *********************************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 6 Nov 1994 17:27:08 EST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List Comments: Converted from PROFS to RFC822 format by PUMP V2.2X From: Rebecca Leist Sturgeon Subject: Text ideas: Psychology of gender In-Reply-To: note of 11/05/94 13:52 Graduate Teaching Assistant--English Phone: 588-5921 Other good books are _Women's Ways of Knowing_ (Belenky, et al.) and, of course, _In a Different Voice (Carol Gilligan). I would like to hear more about how you plan to struture the course. What are you using as factors which diffentiate women's psychological makeup from men's? Are you connecting the material in the course with your students possible future experience in the business world? If so, how? I think one of the most interesting things about using material like this in the classroom is the opportunity it gives us to deal with real life issues and concerns. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 6 Nov 1994 17:44:49 EST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List Comments: Converted from PROFS to RFC822 format by PUMP V2.2X From: Rebecca Leist Sturgeon Subject: feminist responses and safe space Graduate Teaching Assistant--English Phone: 588-5921 I find it interesting to follow the slowly dwindling thread of the "safe space" discussion coupled with "the proper feminist response to criticism" discussion. First, I'm a little wary of labeling any sort of response "proper" in terms of feminism. One of the reasons I call myself a feminist is because I see feminism as a movemnet which challenges that which is seen as "proper." The heart of it all . . . while I do think Daphne was brave to share her original posting with this list, I wonder if this has made the list a less safe space, in a way? Any thoughts? Rebecca Sturgeon rlstur01@ulkyvm.louisville.edu ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 6 Nov 1994 15:28:08 -0800 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: juhui 'judy' han Subject: courage In-Reply-To: <199411061827.AA18994@plague.berkeley.edu> I'm horrified that a private message could be displayed ("waved") in public and without the sincerity to comment on the content--Daphne's "I won't _bother_ to comment on the particulars." If even Joan thinks that Michelle did the right thing in sending her criticism privately to Daphne, and Daphne was wrong to forward it to the list, then I wonder who might be the "right type of person" to be involved on this list. I don't mean to call for a vote. I was just noting the irony of who got "hurt" as a result of the original flaming. And also, who's being commended on the list for her "courage." ------------------------- juhui "judy" han hanjuhui@ocf.berkeley.edu ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 6 Nov 1994 18:51:32 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: DAPHNE PATAI Subject: proper and improper In-Reply-To: <199411062122.QAA08123@holmes.umd.edu> from "G. Vinton Palazzolo" at Nov 6, 94 04:17:12 pm Dear Folks, I am sorry to be taking up more space and will be brief:One doesn't need a philosophical discussion to see that personal attacks and abusive and sarcastic comments are NOT an invitation to dialogue. I have no trouble questioning whether such h comments are something other than "proper." It's not "man-hating" comments that show feminism's in trouble, even less is it criticizing someone for publicizing their own work, it's the intolerant attitude, in this instance displayed by Michelle, to a very non-inflammatory but critical comment by me about some feminist behavior. My whole point was women ARE doing this to other women, in the name of feminism, and it doesn't help to deny it. Michelle then proved my point. -- ====================== Daphne.Patai@spanport.umass.edu ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 6 Nov 1994 19:16:00 EST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Georgia NeSmith Subject: "holier than thou" (was grandstanding feminists) I unfortunately deleted Daphne Patai's discussion of "man-hating" feminists, arguing that the media are not responsible for the wide-spread perception of all feminists as man-hating. So if I err in my recollection of that point, I apologize in advance. While I will grant that there are "man-haters" among women who identify themselves as feminists, I hardly think that media can be judged not guilty of promoting the perception of ALL feminists as such. I have been involved with feminist movements (both political and academic) for more than 20 years. I have yet to encounter more than an exceedingly small proportion of feminists who could be considered "man-haters," and many of the few who could be classified as such have some pretty darn good reasons for hating men. As a women's studies teacher and as one who has attempted to "mainstream" feminist perspectives into all my courses, I have encountered many students who claim to be "silenced" by my open claim to being a feminist. On evaluations many students have accused me of trying to "shove feminism down their throats." However, a colleague (male) who observed me teaching one of my classes found that I listened to students who challenged me, and responded, not by intimidating, dogmatic arguments but rather with questions that challenged the students' unfounded assumptions. I have NEVER humiliated ANY student, even if the student replies to a question with a totally off-the-wall (and sexist) remark. My colleague perceived what I was doing as encouraging critical thinking -- something we all know can be extremely discomforting and scarey for students, particularly since they've never encountered that style of teaching before. "Holier-than-thou" is in the eyes of the beholder. The charge can be made against ANYONE who offers criticism of another's point of view. For example, those who charge some feminists with taking a "holier-than- thou" point of view could also be seen as taking a "holier-than-thou" position -- "I'm holier than those 'man-hating,' dogmatic feminists." This is not to suggest that feminists should not criticize other feminists, but rather that the terms "grandstanding feminists" or "holier-than-thou feminists" are too slippery, and labels like that can too easily be used against ALL feminists by those who have a vested interest in the status quo. I have not read Daphne's book, where, I am told by one of her supporters, Daphne makes perfectly clear what she means by the term "grandstanding feminists." I don't think it's appropriate (or even logical) to expect that everyone on this list be familiar with the publications of all those who participate in the discussions. I think it IS appropriate to suggest that participants make themselves clear in their postings, at least in subsequent postings when others have asked them to clarify their arguments. On another, related point: I personally am committed to the ideal of non-hierachical, communitarian, cooperative forms of social organization. Yes, I recognize that such commitment (and my effort to practice it) is a *moral* stance. That commitment derives not only from my take on feminism, but also from my direct experience with the consensus process as a Quaker. I believe that form of human governance is better than the hierarchical structures we have now -- does that mean that I am therefore taking a "holier than thou" position? I guess so. Georgia NeSmith Rochester NY ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 6 Nov 1994 19:50:54 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Oliver Garfield Subject: Re: proper and improper In-Reply-To: <199411062352.SAA10263@holmes.umd.edu> I fail to see why criticisiing an author posting notice about a book or the recipient of a private note posting it to a list are sexist or feminist issues. I have already suggested that books should be reviewed and their prices and sources made available on the list simply because the purpose of mailing lists is to disseminate ideas and information. The concepts of netiquette get confused sometimes. Obviously irrelevant advertising is not what anyone on the lists wants but people do want to keep up with the subject matter of the list and it ight even be nice to "interview" authors by having subscribers address questions to them to answer. This would be comparable to a radio or Tv talk show with authors. Authors should also have an opportunity to defend their points of view since the dialog evokes more than the prepared text. To conclude I think both parties to this discussion (please note I have not added gender terms) are correct in their actions. If someone sends me a private note I do not publicise its contents. I hope these comments by a male subscriber will not be considered sexist. Oliver Garfield *********************************************************************** *Oliver Garfield email: oliver@panix.com * *World Health Foundation phone: 212-877-4230 * *125 Riverside Drive * *New York, NY 10024 * * * *********************************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 6 Nov 1994 18:44:25 PST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List Comments: Resent-From: KENDEL@UVVM.UVic.CA Comments: Originally-From: TAYLOR@UWPG02.UWINNIPEG.CA From: Monica Kendel CALL FOR PAPERS CALL FOR PAPERS CALL FOR PAPERS CALL FOR PAPERS ----------------------------Original message---------------------------- > > Canadian Lesbian and Gay Studies Association > > Societe Canadienne pour les Etudes Lesbiennes et Gaies > > > > Call for Papers > > Second Annual Conference > > Universite de Quebec a Montreal > > June 3-4, 1995 > > > > > > The 1995 conference of the Canadian Lesbian and Gay Studies > > Association will take place at the Learned Societies Conference > > at the Universite de Quebec a Montreal. As an interdisciplinary > > association, we have tried to position ourselves between the > > humanities and social sciences so that as many interested people > > as possible might be able to attend. We invite papers in any > > aspect of Lesbian and/or Gay and/or Queer studies. Papers may be > > in either English or French. We also welcome submissions from > > anyone who wishes to assemble a panel on a particular topic. > > Abstracts from each panel member should be submitted with the > > proposal. We will also consider proposals for sessions not > > centred on papers: discussion or roundtable. Please submit an > > abstract of the paper, approximately 150-250 words, by January > > 20, 1995. Abstracts will be vetted by the executive of the > > Association. Send abstracts to: > > > > Professor Debra Shogan, > > Women's Studies > > Tory Building University of Alberta Edmonton, Alberta Canada T6G 2E9 > > All participants must be members of the Canadian Lesbian and Gay > > Studies Association. To become a member send information of your name, address, phone and fax number and e-mail with a cheque payable to the Canadian Lesbian and Gay Studies Association. Please mail your cheque to Doug Arrell, Secretary-Treasurer, CLAGSA, Department of Theatre, University of Winnipeg, 515 Portage Avenue, Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada, R3B 2E9. Annual fees for general membership is $20.00, and $10.00 for students or underemployed. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Nov 1994 08:45:33 CST Reply-To: hofmann@grill.onb.ac.at Sender: Women's Studies List From: "Mag. Helga Hofmann" unsibscribe wmst-l Helga Hofmann-Weinberger Tel: +43 1 53410/487 A R I A D N E Fax: +43 1 53410/437 \sterreichische Nationalbibliothek E-Mail: hofmann@grill.onb.ac.at A-1015 Wien, Josefsplatz 1, Europe ariadne@grill.onb.ac.at ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Nov 1994 01:11:48 -0800 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Jo Trigilio Subject: promoting our work In-Reply-To: <199411061810.NAA04208@holmes.umd.edu> I want to thank Joan Koreman for saying that it is appropriate for members of the list to promote their work. To begin with, I am very interested in knowing what kind of work members of the list are engaged in. Secondly, (call me a romantic communitarian) I like the idea of list members supporting each other's work. What I appreciate most about WMST-L is the supportive atmosphere, and I would not want that to change. Jo Trigilio University of Oregon trigilio@oregon.uoregon.edu ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Nov 1994 07:47:06 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Jane Elza Subject: Re: "Grandstanding Feminists" In-Reply-To: <199411060357.WAA26847@holmes.umd.edu> some students interpret anything which goes against their beliefs to be grandstanding. one student in a class here wrote to student newspaper objecting to being forced to use gender neutral terms in a soc. class. the 'rabidly' feminist teacher had marked his grade down because he did not follow the directions. in this age of mass media, the message sent is not always the message received. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Nov 1994 08:04:38 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Jane Elza Subject: Re: promoting our work In-Reply-To: <199411070912.EAA22269@holmes.umd.edu> on one bulletin board i belong to, a discussion of free speech conveyed a decidedly libertarian tone, i.e. all speech should be allowed, until someone raised the issue of advertising. Unanymus agreement emerged that advertising should be banned. this was due in part to some lawyers out west somewhere who bombed a list with advertisements. The guideline that developed was that if you received financial benefit from the message, you couldn't post it. Noting that one has discussed the issue in one's book does not mean people will rush out and buy it, nor is it intended to encourage one to buy. Libraries supply many references. It seems to me intent is as relevant as result here. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Nov 1994 08:51:35 -0500 Reply-To: korenman@UMBC2.UMBC.EDU Sender: Women's Studies List From: Joan Korenman Subject: Message from the listowner (please read) Hi. I have used the subject header "message from the listowner" because I couldn't fit three different topics on one header. PLEASE READ THIS MESSAGE: 1) Over the weekend, there was a lot of mail about one subscriber's forwarding to WMST-L an inflammatory private message from another subscriber. Please, LET'S NOW DROP THIS THREAD. If you want to continue discussing this, please do so privately, not on the list. 2) Earlier today, one subscriber expressed an interest in knowing what kind of work others on WMST-L are engaged in. If you wish to respond to this question, PLEASE RESPOND PRIVATELY to trigilio@oregon.uoregon.edu, NOT TO WMST-L! WMST-L has over 3300 subscribers--if only 10% of them replied publicly, we'd all be overwhelmed with messages and many people with limited disk quotas, limited time, and/or limited funds would be forced to unsubscribe. 3) Regardless of what the policy on other lists may be, WMST-L has always welcomed information from subscribers about new books they have written on Women's Studies topics. Information about work NOT in Women's Studies should be sent elsewhere, not to WMST-L. Many thanks for your understanding and cooperation. Joan Korenman ***************************************************************************** * Joan Korenman Internet: korenman@umbc2.umbc.edu * * U. of Md. Baltimore County Bitnet: korenman@umbc * * Baltimore, MD 21228-5398 * * * * The only person to have everything done by Friday was Robinson Crusoe * ***************************************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Nov 1994 08:55:56 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Cheryl Sattler Subject: Re: Feminist Pedagogy My dissertation, which is under review as a book manuscript, deals precisely with feminist pedagogy in high schools and universities. It reviews the literature (back much farther than 10 years!!) on feminist teaching and has something in the neighborhood of 30 pages of citations. It is titled _Talking About A Revolution: The Politics and Practice of Feminist Teaching_. The primary focus of my work (as a social scientist) was to compare the literature with the practice of feminist women teachers and to ask if the literature adequately presented *practice* as well as *theory*. I interviewed 9 women extensively and their transcripts (hundreds and hundreds of pages) are fascinating. Dissertations, as you probably know, are available through interlibrary loan and dissertation abstracts international. One word of caution, Amy--this is not a small project, and not one to be undertaken casually. There is a tremendous amount of literature. _________________ Cheryl Sattler, Ph.D. Florida State University FAX (904) 644-0643 PHONE (904) 644-1142 internet: sattler@bio.fsu.edu ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Nov 1994 09:02:44 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Su Epstein Subject: feminism, safe space, flaming This is my first, "real" post to a list, but with my blood pressure up, I ju I can't keep quiet any more. First, I would like to say I am a feminist, despite growing up thinking that feminist was a dirty word. You may see why I thought that by reading the posts of the last few days. My experience through much of my undergraduate and graduate work was that other self proclaimed "feminists" were out right hostile _to everyone_. I, and others, felt that there was a private club where if you said the right thing and agreed and were liked, you could join and if you said the wrong thing, you were ignored (saying the right thing was not simply man hating - in some circles, yes, but in others it was other things -like being attacked for the suggestion that there are grandstanding feminist, for example). Sometimes I said the right things and was liked and accepted, other times I was not, either way it was a system I did not want to play in so silently I avoided it. As a result, I also avoided the term feminist because I did not want to be associated with people who I viewed as petty and closed minded, even if we did share a view of how the world operated. When a friend suggested I join this list, I was hesitant, every contact I have had with "women's studies" organizations had lead me to dismay and the definate feeling of not being in a "safe space." I joined figuring to cancel within a few days. Over the past few months I have been pleasantly surprised that there has been a sharing of ideas and openness and what has sounded as sincere concern over greater issues. I have been, sadly, truely shocked to see open discussions and sharing - while I know this is what women's studies claims to be about - I had never experienced it. Then...What happened? In the discussions that have been raised over grandstanding feminists and wheither to share personal posts - what has happened? Once again I see the actions that made me cringe at the "f" word -- all of the old sentiments: "if you don't agree with me, then I won't play anymore and I'm not going to listen to YOU, I Know what YOUR TYPE says...," "Anyone has the right to sn private is nobody's buisness." her to share it in public eithoes so in private, does that make the behavior accep able? Does that mean she shouldn't share it? (Now before you all go off saying I am compairng flaming to wife beating - Let me make perfectly clear - that is NOT my point. My point is - THINK about this - if this makes you uncomfortable - then ask your self why? EXACTLY why?) How ironic that an express concern over a particular kind of behavior would illicit such perfect examples of it! My call here is to say - enough -- if you don't like a particular system - then don't operate just like the system you critisize. If there are things you don't want made public - then don't say them to strangers. If you don't agree with a group then by all means leave the group but why attack them? The bottom the line here is that this is an academic forum. And let's be blunt - academics is not a nice safe place. But the ONLY thing we have, is allegedly the skills to think about implications, consequences and meanings and the ability to analyse. If there is one person left out there who still feels a classroom is not a safe space or feminist is a nasty title, then our job is to ask why and try to address that. Maybe we don't like some of the answers that we hear, but to attack at them or to run from them just makes them all the more credable. BTW, I started calling myself a feminist because I DON'T believe in oppression and I DON'T think anyone should be silenced, wheither I agree with them or not. I call myself a feminist to remind all of those grandstanding feminist - and all of those who make my world uncomfortable (feminisist and non-feminists alike) that there are greater things at issue here and that feminism is perspective, not a sorority, for I for one am not a member. Although I fear this is in vain, I for one request we go back to the larger issues at hand and that those who wish to flame or support me do so privately - Thank you. Su Epstein SCEPSTEIN@gallua.gallaudet.edu ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Nov 1994 08:47:29 CST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Kris Anderson Subject: NWSA Conference Update This is a reminder that thee deadline for submission of proposals for the NWSA June 1995 meeting is fast approaching (Nov 8). We can receive proposals (1 or 2 page abstracts) by email(wmst@uwyo.edu), by FAX (307-766-3812), or by mail: NWSA 95; Women's Studies; Ross 405; University of Wyoming; Laramie 82071-4297. Planning is well underway for the conference, the theme of which is "Women's Movements: Cultural, Intellectual, and Political (R)evolutions," and we are very excited to report that Beverly Guy-Sheftall has agreed to deliver the keynote address. Featuring a wide range of powerful voices, our plenary sessions promise to be the highlights of the conference again this year; already confirmed speakers include: Louise Bernikow, Inez Telemantes, Mildred Jeffrey, Valerie Kameya, Tania Modleski, Andrea Nye, Cynthia Enloe, Chrystos, Bonnie Thornton Dill, Inez Hernandez, Ros Petcheskey, Betty Harris, Leslie Feinberg, and Charlotte Bunch. NWSA is very pleased to be able to collaborate with two other groups who will running concurrent meetings. Speakers and sessions will be shared with both the English Department's Writing Conference and the Indigenous Women's Network in order to create greater depth and diversity in our program. In addition to a rich array of sessions, the conference will also feature a Writers Series, Film Series, Cultural Events Series, and Art Exhibits. Special pre- and post-conference excursions into the spectacular Wyoming mountains and forests will be made available to conference registrants. If you have not received a Call for Papers, email Patsy Taylor at wmst@uwyo.edu or call her at 307-766-6872 and request one. The University of Wyoming campus will provide a beautiful and congenial setting for our1995 conference and we look forward to seeing you all there. If there's a session you want to see in the program, propose it. The shape and the scope of this conference is up to you. Kris Anderson NWSA Conference Committee Chair ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Nov 1994 10:01:34 EDT Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Irene Devine Organization: Ryerson Polytechnic University Subject: (Fwd) RESOURCES FOR WOMEN IN INDIA Forwarded message: From: Self To: WMST-L@UMDD.UMD.EDU Subject: RESOURCES FOR WOMEN IN INDIA Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 13:18:28 I have been selected to serve as a Canadian Resource Faculty for a Workshop on Development of Women in Management (private sector focus) to be conducted in Pune, India in early January 1995. I will be conducting five sessions of approximately one and a half hours in length. My background is in Organizational Behavior, training and gender dynamics in organizations. I would appreciate any assistance related to conditions in India that I should know as I plan, e.g. cultural differences of managerial women in India and North America that should be taken into account. If anyone has suggestions re content that they think women in India in mid-management positions in the private sector would find relevant and/or resources I could turn to, I would be very appreciative. Please reply privately to: devine@aim1.bus.ryerson.ca Thank You. Irene Devine, Ph.D. School of Administration and Information Management Ryerson Polytechnic University 350 Victoria Street Toronto, Ontario, M5B 2K3 ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Nov 1994 10:05:18 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: "Nelda K. Pearson" Subject: Re: journals In-Reply-To: <199411061503.KAA01722@holmes.umd.edu> from "Jo Ellen Green Kaiser" at Nov 6, 94 09:29:32 am Hello list- I agree with Jo Ellen on j.urnalling on the readings. Going back to graduate school in the late sixties there was a prof who required a sexual journal/autobiography of all students in his Soc of Family class. since I shared his office I knew what he did with them. Evetually he ended up in court. We had a similar problem with a social work professor at my current institution. This preson was more benign but still was asking for personal intimate details. On the other hand, if you merely use journals for comment on readings or class discussion than it is the strudent's choice. HOWEVER, we still get alot of sensitive material. Doing inclass writings in Gender Roles on violence invariably brings out some rather long self confessions of abusive realtionships. I have struggled with how best to handle these things. I am not their therapist nor their mama (well now it getting toward being their grandma). I listen but even that can get you in trouble. AI student came to me with concerns about a colleague of mine. I listened and then told her that although she might be right, i didn't think she had a case of sexual harassment. She pursued the case and I had to sit on the firsat committee that heard the case. I abstainded stating that i had prior knowledge. I was then accussed of instigating the suit. That was four years ago and I still get backlash from it. Gender issues are still an area that are not totally legitmated as an area of valid complaint. This often puts those of us who teach women's studies and gender issues in a very delicate position. We must carefully weigh our students rights and needs against the climate we are in. (Does this sound paranoid or am I jsut getting weary of seeing the same fight over and over again for women). Journaling is valuable tool. It also is one that needs a great eal of sensitivity. Nelda npearson@ruacad.ac.runet.edu ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Nov 1994 11:11:30 AST-3ADT Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Joanne Gallivan Organization: UCCB.NS.CA Subject: Tisdale article there's also an excerpt in the latest issue of esquire ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Nov 1994 09:51:09 -0400 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: "Joan D. Mandle" Subject: Re: safe space in the classroom It seems to me that "bullying" should not go on in classrooms (or elsewhere for that matter). That said, asking students to give reasons for their views is one of the most important way to encourage them to learn to think for themselves and question their own views. This is essential. To conflate that with bullying is specious. Teachers who require thoughtful reasons by bullying are undermining good teaching, but of course we have not defined bullying. If we see students as fragile and ill, then simply asking them anything maybe interpreted as bullying. I find it terribly condescending to assume that students, especially female students, have to be treated as if they are mentally ill. They should be treated with respect, as competent adults, as should we. Joan D. Mandle Director, Women's Studies Colgate University jdmandle@center.colgate.edu ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Nov 1994 10:48:00 EDT Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Joan Korenman Subject: Too much mail? Try edited digest (User's Guide) Each month, I post sections from the WMST-L User's Guide to remind subscribers of the list's resources and procedures. If changes have been made since the last time a section was posted, the subject header will begin "Revision:". Also, you can now consult the User's Guide anytime you'd like if you have access to gopher. Gopher to gopher.umbc.edu and select Academic Department Info (currently #5), then Women's Studies (currently #9), then WMST-L (currently #5). Meanwhile, here is a section many people may find most useful at the moment, that describing the edited WMST-L digest: 6) "DOES WMST-L EXIST IN A DIGEST OR INDEX FORMAT?" Yes. If you choose the digest option, each day you will receive anywhere from one to five files containing most of the WMST-L messages of the past day (messages that should not have been sent to the list to begin with are omitted). Related messages will usually be put in the same file, and each file will begin with a table of contents. The digest reduces both mail clutter and, usually, mail volume. (Please note that this is NOT the huge, unselective bundle of messages that many listserv digest features provide. Do NOT use their digest command.) If you would like to receive the daily digest file rather than individual mail messages, you should send the following 2-line e-mail message to LISTSERV@UMDD (if your WMST-L subscription is under your Bitnet address) or LISTSERV@UMDD.UMD.EDU (if your subscription is under your Internet address): AFD ADD WMST-L PACKAGE SET WMST-L NOMAIL Note: If you've subscribed on Bitnet, the digest may arrive as a file rather than as an e-mail message. If you don't know how to receive a file, see section 11 of the WMST-L User's Guide or ask the computer support people at your institution. If you'd prefer to receive the digest(s) inside mail message(s), alter the abovementioned AFD ADD statement to read as follows: AFD ADD WMST-L PACKAGE F=MAIL . However, even if you receive the digest(s) as mail messages, YOU CANNOT REPLY AUTOMATICALLY! If you wish to reply to a message in the digest, you must start a new message and address it either to WMST-L or to the individual. Also, LISTSERV may ask you to set up an AFD password. You're best off not doing so. Finally, if at some point you wish to STOP receiving the digest, either temporarily or permanently, send LISTSERV a message that says AFD DEL WMST-L PACKAGE . If you wish to unsubscribe AND stop the digest, add a second line that says UNSUB WMST-L . [There is also an index option; I think it's less useful, since so many subject headers are misleading. For more information about the Index option, consult the User's Guide.] Joan Korenman Internet: korenman@umbc2.umbc.edu Bitnet: korenman@umbc ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Nov 1994 10:13:29 LCL Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Ruth Ginzberg Organization: Philosophy Dept., Wesleyan University Subject: journals I frequently have students in my classes keep journals, which I do read & comment in, but I make a big deal at the beginning of class abt talking about what the journals are & aren't for. I explicitly refer to them as *Intellectual* Journals, and explicitly tell students that I do *NOT* want these to contain "Dear Diary" types of entries, such as "Dear Diary, I had a fantastic date last night, etc..." (I often do this kind of as a 'laugh' line... but mean it) I also tell them that I do not want "mere" reading notes; that I want their Intellectual Journals to contain their thoughts & reflections on the readings and in-class discussions. I suggest that they use their journals as places to "work on" fledgling ideas & thoughts which they may later elect to turn into more formal papers. I also tell them that in the course of the class, what counts as 'Intellectual' may becme problematized, and that I realize this will sometimes present interesting questions abt what belongs in an "Intellectual Journal" but that thinking this through is part of the coursework, and the Journal itself might be a good place to record one's evolving thoughts on that subject. I also remind them that I will read and comment on these journals (or, in some cases, that course TA's might), and that they ABSOLUTELY should NOT write anything in their journals which is more personal than what they wish to disclose to me (or TA's), and that they should think carefully about that and be aware of their own needs for personal boundaries and privacy. Of course, I have sometimes gotten personal revelations in journals, but this happens during office hours too (occasionally --- far MORE occasionally w women faculty than w men faculty in my estimation, but anyway...). As a teacher I have felt the responsibility to intervene in some ways in a few cases -- once when a male student wrote that he was thinking seriously of committing suicide; once when a female student wrote that she was pregnant and terrified and felt completely alone; once when a female student with a disability complained that nobody in the class ever wanted to do groupwork with her because she suspected they were uncomfortable with her visually obvious disability (I was very glad to learn that this was happening in order to be able to intervene); and several times when I have referred students to physicians for assessment of possible health problems, or to counselors, or to the rape crisis center, or to self-help groups, for difficulties with such things as drug and/or alcohol problems, eating disorders, etc. I just see this as an incidental part of my job, when it comes up, though I don't particularly encourage students to take me into their confidence in these ways. I *certainly* don't GRADE students on what they say in what are obvious requests for help. But I do try to refer them to better sources of help and support than myself or the classroom, when it seems appropriate. I think that frequent & careful classroom discussion of what kinds of things you are hoping to see in journals, and careful respect for students' privacy and for the obvious power differences between faculty & students, helps to make journals more useful without being invasive. ----------- Ruth Ginzberg (rginzberg@eagle.wesleyan.edu) ------------ ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Nov 1994 11:07:37 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List Comments: W: Incorrect or incomplete address field found and ignored. From: Iana Pattatucci Subject: Re: man-hating Sarah Lucia Hoagland addresses this quite nicely in her book _LESBIAN ETHICS_, as does Bell Hooks in _BLACK LOOKS_, and several other authors. They see it in terms of power dynamics. That is, those in power (privileged) believe that it is their inalienable right to have access to all that the marginalized have. The reverse, of course, is not true. Feminism, thus, is viewed as anti-male or man-hating by many men because it is woman-centered and does not immediately acquiesce to the traditional power dynamics. This labeling is actually quite juvenile, reminiscent of playground behavior. iana "luciana%bchem.dnet@dxi.nih.gov" ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Nov 1994 11:52:25 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Helena Cochrane Subject: Reply to request for film name In-Reply-To: <199411051339.IAA16604@holmes.umd.edu> Ilene, go no further, it "Bajii on the Beach", and it sounded like` a really great movie. It played at the Ritz into September, so I saw the preview. Helena ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Nov 1994 11:15:18 -0600 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: greta gaard Subject: Re: the proper feminist response to criticism??? In-Reply-To: <199411061808.MAA18528@ub.d.umn.edu> Regarding Michelle's dismay that Daphne had posted a private message: it may be naive, but I have believed that as feminists we are attempting to create a movement and a community that (unlike white hetero-capitalist-patriarchy) is ACCOUNTABLE. I would like to imagine that we communicate with one another, privately and publicly, AS IF a number of feminist communities of varying identities were present. I would also like to imagine that we are capable of criticizing ourselves and each other in a way that is constructive and respectful. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Nov 1994 09:41:53 -0800 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Joan Gundersen Subject: paper call Please share this call with other lists and individuals you think would be interested: Call for Papers The Episcopal Women's History Project invites submission of paper proposals for a conference on Southern Episcopal Women to be held at St. Mary's College, Raleigh, N.C. on June 2-4, 1995. Papers may explore any period of history and can be comparative, but must address in part the experience of women in the Episcopal Church tradition. Proposals on African-American, American Indian, and Hispanic women within the Episcopal or Anglican Church in the southern U.S. are especially welcome. Send proposals to Dr. Patricia Nichols Page, 715 Shepherd St., Durham, N.C. 27701 by February 1, 1995. Submitted by joan_gundersen@csusm.edu ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Nov 1994 09:52:51 -0800 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Joan Gundersen Subject: advice I have a student who is seeking advice about graduate school programs. She just graduated with a B.A. in psychology and has volunteer experience as a facilitator for the Family Violence Intervention Program of a local women's resource center. She works with court-ordered males who have battered women. She is a returning student, Asian/Hispanic, with an interest in graduate programs leading to the Ph.D. in counseling with a psychology of women emphasis. She is especially interested the connection of sex roles, teen pregnancy and violence; gender roles and career choices of teen-aged girls; gender roles and academic achievement; the impact of sex-role stereotypes on women in the workplace; and the development of learned helplessness and its relationship to depression in women. She has a minor in Women's Studies and came to me for advice. Psychology is not my field and so I am asking for your advice. She is most concerned to find a graduate school that not only lines up with her interests, but would be supportive of an middle-aged, married student with a young child. She can look anywhere in the U.S. Reply privately to joan_gundersen@csusm.edu. Joan Gundersen Women's Studies Program Director California State University, San Marcos San Marcos, CA 92096 ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Nov 1994 13:11:06 EST Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Liza Feldman Subject: Re: Labels In-Reply-To: Message of Fri, 4 Nov 1994 22:55:06 -0500 from Michele- I think some undergraduate students, like the one in your class, define feminism differently than we might. Based on informal discussions with undergraduates, I think the problem is that many feminist issues have become mainstreamed. For example, the right to choose an abortion, equal employment rights, etc. are now taken for granted, and are often not seen as feminist issues. Because of these recent gains, many see feminism as some extreme radical political ideology, often associated with lesbian separatists. Many undergrads often think feminism is about hating men. Men have accused me of not being a feminist because "they can talk to me, and I have a sense of humor". On the one hand, it is a sign of progress that some feminist issues can be taken for granted, on the other it is unfortunate that feminism has gotten a bad rep. We have to educate those around us, and set an example that feminism is not about hating men. Liza Feldman Anthropology Department University at Albany LF7256@cnsibm.albany.edu ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Nov 1994 13:07:20 -0600 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: wood gretchen ann Subject: graduate schools I am graduating this May with a degree in Psychology/Womens Studies and would like to go to grad school in Human Development and Family Studies. Does anyone know of a program that offers adolescent issues (esp girls) such as pregnancy, choice making, academic achievement, etc and that also has policy studies regarding women and children? Please mail me back privately. gretchen wood University of Illinois ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Nov 1994 14:38:52 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Ilene Lieberman Subject: Reply to Reply to request for film name In-Reply-To: <199411071652.LAA01769@holmes.umd.edu> thanks for the info. I actually got a large number of responses, including one that took me to task for misidentifying the director and the city (did you see it on the list? Boy, I'll think twice about sending out a feeler to those babes you can count on it.) Sorry about lunch--I just didn't feel like waiting. tata ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Nov 1994 14:35:32 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Meg Baughman Organization: West Virginia Network Subject: Info needed re Viola Spolin I have just signed on. Hi everybody. I am taking a women and creativity course. I am doing a paper on Viola Spolin -- and am trying to look at her creative output from a feminine perspective. If you know of any articles about her or her work I would appreciate how, where, what. Thank you. Meg Baughman mbghmn@wunums.wvnet.edu ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Nov 1994 15:27:50 -0600 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: flood dawn rae Subject: Diana E.H. Russell Hi everyone! I am posting this message for a friend who does not have an e-mail address, so please reply to me. Thanks in advance. "Does anyone know how I can get in touch with Diana E.H. Russell? The publication of her last book, "Making Violence Sexy" (1993) in the About the Editor section listed her as currently a Professor Emerita of Sociology at Mills College. I'm currently dealing with a situation regarding violence against women in mass media print (but it was only a joke!), and I think her input would be extremely useful." If anyone has an office, or e-mail address for her, please reply privately to: Dawn Flood graduate student University of Illinois - Urbana/Champaing flood@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Nov 1994 16:09:20 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List Comments: Warning -- RSCS tag indicates an origin of $SMTPSRV@UMDD From: Linda Pershing Subject: Women and romance novels A graduate student in one of my courses is interested in researching romance novels and their creation and interpretation by women. She is aware of Radway's book, "Reading the Romance," but would also like to locate other current sources and materials on this topic. She is doing a research project for a class in feminist theory and the study of folklore, so one of her interests is the ways in which women create their own communities of readers and writers and how they use this form of expression to define themselves as women in their worlds. She would be most appreciative of receiving suggestions for readings and feedback from other feminist scholars who have done work in this area. Please contact her directly at the address below. Thanks for your help, Linda Pershing, State Univ. of NY at Albany Please send info. directly to: Margaret Geehan, MG6591@ Margaret Geehan, MG6591@cnsvax.albany.edu ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Nov 1994 17:19:55 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Cynthia Ho Organization: University of North Carolina at Asheville Subject: Job listing Modern Europe and Women's Studies. Tenure track Assistant Professorship beginning August 1995. Continental Europe, 19th or 20th century, French specialty preferred, but others considered (except Britain or Russia). Minor field in Africa or Latin America, or Ancient or Women's History. Twelve hour teaching load. Ph. D. in hand by Aug. 95. Send letter including a statement on undergraduate teaching practices, cv, and three current references to Bruce Greenawalt, Chair, History Dept., Univ. of North Carolina at Asheville 28804. Mention any convention plans. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Nov 1994 17:30:57 -0400 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Linda Majka AFD ADD WMST-L PACKAGE F=MAIL SET WMST-L NOMAIL ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Nov 1994 16:44:48 LCL Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: kathleen hickok Subject: Re: sources on WS classroom practice? Learning Our Way, edited (I think) by Charlotte Bunch ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Nov 1994 18:08:10 -0600 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: crowell ellen m Subject: Re: Text ideas: Psychology of gender In-Reply-To: <199411051851.AA14256@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu> I would recommend Leslie Feinberg's Stone Butch Blues for any psychology of gender course. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Nov 1994 19:28:23 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: J Starker Subject: ideas re: adult development text I'm trying to find a new book for my graduate adult development class. The book would need to address both female and male development and must be interesting to read! One theme of the class is the importance of telling one's story (we also use NUMBER OUR DAYS in this class, which is superb). It would be great to find a book of "stories" that deals with adult developmental issues. Any suggestions would be appreciated! Thank you in advance. J. Starker Lewis and Clark College J Starker @AOL.com ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Nov 1994 14:39:41 -1000 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Diane Maluso Subject: Re: Text ideas: Psychology of gender In-Reply-To: <9411080011.AA25109@uhunix.uhcc.Hawaii.Edu> I'd recommend the following edited volume: Beall, A.E., & Sternberg, R.J. (1993). The Psychology of Gender. New York: Guilford Publications. This volume is an edited collection of chapters which each present a different theory of gender. Some of these theories are social psychological, cognitive, social learning, developmental, evolutionary, psychodynamic. Contributors include Geis, Cross & Markus, Lott & Maluso, Kenrick & Trost, Fast, Jacklin & Reynolds, Best & Williams, Banaji. Caveat: I'm the second author of the fourth chapter. And I don't want to hear about grandstanding anymore. =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Diane Maluso Psychology and Women's Studies 722 Porteus Hall Honolulu, HI 96822 maluso@uhunix.uhcc.hawaii.edu =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Nov 1994 19:44:01 -0500 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Jo Hinchliffe Subject: Race, Gender and the Construction of Canada conference In-Reply-To: <9411061725.AA01235@unixg.ubc.ca> RACE, GENDER AND THE CONSTRUCTION OF CANADA OCTOBER 19-22, 1995 CALL FOR PAPERS This interdisciplinary conference is being organized by a research team based in the Centre for Research in Women's Studies and Gender Relations at the University of British Columbia. The conference organizers welcome submissions that explore the conference theme in an interdisciplinary context or that approach questions of race and gender within Canada from an interdisciplinary perspective. Proposals may be for individual presentations (papers fo 20 minutes in length) or for panels with three or four presenters. Specific topics may range from the impact of health policy upon sectors of the Canadian population to constitutional reform, the historical treatment of gender, ethnicity, and class, or to literary, artistic, and film representations of race and gender within the context of Canadian identity and citizenship. Interdisciplinary papers or panels that bring together such varied disciplines or professionals as lawyers, filmmakers, constitutional experts, health care workers, and writers are especially welcome. Submissions from graduate students are encouraged. Featured Guest Speakers include: Himani Bannerji and Glenda Simms. Deadline for receipt of abstracts (250 words) is March 15, 1995. For further information and registration details contact: Conference '95 Centre for Research in Women's Studies and Gender Relations 1896 East Mall, University of B.C. phone 604-822-9171, fax 604-822-9169 or joey@unixg.ubc.ca ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Nov 1994 17:31:28 -0800 Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Madelyn Detloff <6500mad@UCSBUXA.UCSB.EDU> Subject: "man-hating" and homophobia In-Reply-To: <199411071550.KAA29039@holmes.umd.edu> I have been following the recent developments in the "safe-space" discussion with great interest. While i haven't read Daphne Patai's new book, and therefore am responding only to the comments i have seen on the list, i am troubled by the characterization of "grandstanding feminists" as discussion stoppers. What is the difference between a "grandstanding feminist" with passionate ideas about gender issues and any other student who might feel strongly about an issue or subject (say Blake's idea of the sublime, or Emmerson's theories on self-reliance)? We want our students (male and female) to feel entitled to speak in class, don't we? We also don't want one or a few students to dominate discussion. From my perspective the whole idea of the "grandstanding feminist" assumes that a feminist perspective is ideologically charged (i.e. biased) and that the other perspectives in the room are somehow ideologically neutral. All intellectual positions are ideological, even those that claim dissinterested objectivity. Our task is to help our students understand how their own intellectual positions are ideologically situated. In re: the phrase "man-hating": i think the political unconscious of this term is homophobic, a vestige of the lesbian baiting that has been and still is used to discredit the feminist movement. ( i know there are women (& feminist women at that) out there who hate men, just as there are quite a few misogynist men out there.) But i think the anxiety among young women who support feminist causes and yet hesitate to call themselves "feminist" is about being mistaken for a dyke. (I am a lesbian, and i call myself a dyke, but i am not a man-hater). I use dyke in its perjorative sense because of the connotations of ugliness, unattractiveness in the economy of male heterosexual desire, the term has in dominant culture. When a woman says something like "i believe in reproductive rights and other women's issues, etc., but i'm not a feminist; i don't want people to think I'm a man-hater," i think the unspoken and maybe unacknowledged subtext of that statement is "i don't want people (especially men) to think i'm a lesbian. i don't want to make myself ineligible to be the object of male desire." I wonder if anyone else out there reads "man-hating" this way? Let me be clear: i don't think we have to accuse young women who use this phrase of homophobia, rather examine the homophobic cultural logic which equates feminism with man-hating with lesbianism *and* assumes that it's a bad thing to be a lesbian or even (especially?) to be mistaken for a lesbian. Madelyn Detloff 6500mad@ucsbuxa.ucsb.edu ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Nov 1994 22:45:00 EDT Reply-To: Women's Studies List Sender: Women's Studies List From: Nancy Goldstein Subject: "Grandstanding people of color" On November 5-6, Rosa Pegueros wrote (in response to my post of the day before): "Grandstanding people of color? Hey, wait a minute. Is this a Freudian slip? Is this what you really feel about people of color expressing their anger at their maltreatment? How about keeping the focus of the argument where it be- longs?" MY RESPONSE: Dear Rosa (and WMST subscribers), That was my point. It would be unthinkable (at least in the circles I inhabit) to refer to a person of color who was expressing anger at their maltreatment as a "grandstanding person of color," which is as it should be. I was implying that Daphne's ability and willingness to do so regarding women who express anger at *their* maltreatment (or who are in some other way too ardently feminist, whatever that means) should be equally unthinkable, but is not in the midst of the political atmosphere that categorizes the feminist backlash of the 90s. Speaking of Freudian slips, I never did get the WMST list from yesterday, so I have no idea who if anyone responded to my post on the list (although I have received a number of private messages, all positive). If you would like me to respond to any comment of yours that appeared that day, would you please send it to me privately. I'll be happy to post my reply privately or on the list, whichever you prefer. Please just let me know. Incidentally, I'd like to publicly back Judy Han's comments regarding the whole Golden/Patai/Korenman debacle. I'm really sorry to see the list lost Michelle, (whoops! that's "lose" Michelle) who was, in my opinion, shabbily treated by the other players. Nancy Goldstein goldstein@binah.cc.brandeis.edu