- Series
- Peace, love, creativity: Hope of mankind
- Air Date
- 1968-01-02
- Duration
- 00:21:59
- Episode Description
- This program presents the second part of a lecture by Lionel Landry, director, The Asia Society.
- Series Description
- This series presents lectures from the 1968 Cooper Union Forum. This forum's theme is Peace, Love, Creativity: The Hope of Mankind.
- Subject(s)
- Creator(s)
- WNYC (Radio station : New York, N.Y.) (Producer)
- Contributors
- Landry, Lionel (Speaker)
- Genre(s)
- Geographic Region(s)
- regions
- Time Period
- 1961-1970
[00:03 - 00:09]
Right. Why didn't we know sooner that this might happen.
[00:09 - 00:15]
I am afraid the people of my generation who worked in Burma before this are probably
[00:15 - 00:20]
to blame for not knowing. We were
[00:20 - 00:24]
ignorant we were ignorant of the modes through which a healthy
[00:24 - 00:29]
syncretism might be achieved in the Buddhist mind between
[00:29 - 00:34]
detachment from things of the world on the one side and the need
[00:34 - 00:38]
for things of the world offered as a compassionate exercise of
[00:38 - 00:43]
Muta. On the other. We spoke about sincerity in helping the
[00:43 - 00:48]
Burmese people reach new levels of standards of living. We
[00:48 - 00:53]
couldn't have spoken wider of the point. I will carry on I really
[00:53 - 00:58]
did not compass the operator of words and concepts
[00:58 - 01:03]
which would have had a real meaning to Burmese borders.
[01:03 - 01:08]
We simply didn't know anything about ourselves and our
[01:08 - 01:13]
values and what we projected of ourselves namely our sincerity
[01:13 - 01:18]
was the last thing that needed to be proved and what needed to be made available.
[01:18 - 01:23]
We failed to provide. We thought that because we were
[01:23 - 01:28]
speaking in English to graduates of Oxford Cambridge Harvard
[01:28 - 01:33]
London. There we were speaking to people who had left their values and their
[01:33 - 01:38]
cultures behind when they had gone to the United Kingdom or the United States.
[01:38 - 01:43]
We treated them as though in fact somebody had research already
[01:43 - 01:49]
succeeded in making them open in making them like us.
[01:49 - 01:54]
Now I'm saying that in spite of the fact that nobody could
[01:54 - 01:59]
fault our intentions. We studied the language. We could speak for me. It's a
[01:59 - 02:03]
difficult language. We learned there are institutions we would sit cross-legged
[02:03 - 02:08]
on mats all night watching the classical theater the classical opera the
[02:08 - 02:13]
marionette shows to absorb some of the values which these people projected through that
[02:13 - 02:19]
some of us marry the women of this country who if I may borrow
[02:19 - 02:24]
a well-known phrase from keep our joy forever.
[02:24 - 02:31]
Still we didn't realize what we would have to
[02:31 - 02:35]
connect in the Grammy's mind with what we were offering
[02:35 - 02:41]
in a more tragic case. It might be pointed out that in the years
[02:41 - 02:44]
1953 54 55 and 56
[02:44 - 02:50]
decisions were being made about the future conduct of our relations with Vietnam in
[02:50 - 02:55]
Washington by people who themselves today ruefully admit
[02:55 - 03:01]
didn't know a word of Vietnamese had never read Vietnamese
[03:01 - 03:06]
history. I had no idea of the extent to which Chinese
[03:06 - 03:11]
Confucian values had actually come to rule that country for a thousand
[03:11 - 03:16]
years. These were people who had not an ounce of
[03:16 - 03:21]
understanding of the habits and the traditions and the values of the Vietnamese people.
[03:21 - 03:26]
They had an ounce of knowledge of the symbolic importance of ceremonial
[03:26 - 03:31]
and ritual etiquette among people they hadn't an ounce of knowledge about the
[03:31 - 03:35]
divisions between the urban mandarins of Vietnam and the
[03:35 - 03:40]
dispossessed as those who roam the countryside having the least of their land by
[03:40 - 03:45]
French Colonials. Then to clue of the duplicity
[03:45 - 03:51]
of the Communists or the French colonials who each got rid of their
[03:51 - 03:55]
enemies by denouncing to the other side the enemies of each one
[03:55 - 04:01]
by betraying their whereabouts to the French police or to the Gullah Stalinist
[04:01 - 04:04]
goon squads respectively.
[04:04 - 04:09]
China is an even more tragic case if only because of its
[04:09 - 04:12]
enormous magnitude. And I can promise you to China
[04:12 - 04:19]
or mainland China of junk I shack and the new mainland China
[04:19 - 04:24]
amounted to on was based on a force but moving and at the time
[04:24 - 04:28]
deeply persuasive romanticism. Today.
[04:28 - 04:34]
We also have to add to this was romanticism. The
[04:34 - 04:39]
ship maps that have become part of the American ethos on the one side we
[04:39 - 04:44]
have William Randolph Hearst sprayers the yellow peril and to this has now
[04:44 - 04:49]
been added the German got the concept of the Red Menace. So we
[04:49 - 04:54]
have a double bogey man in communist China today a bogeyman which we might
[04:54 - 04:58]
call the red yellow menace peril. We're
[04:58 - 05:03]
deploying today and looking at China now as human
[05:03 - 05:07]
resources and intellectual energy unmatched in the history
[05:07 - 05:12]
of one nation's examination of another. China watchers in Hong
[05:12 - 05:17]
Kong. I mean intelligence apparatus our scholars in the
[05:17 - 05:21]
United States and elsewhere know more about the Chinese
[05:21 - 05:26]
than and this can truly be said than the Chinese know about
[05:26 - 05:31]
themselves. The tragedy is that these Americans know
[05:31 - 05:36]
nothing about America or Americans and they are often
[05:36 - 05:40]
analyzing their own satellite. Most of mankind is
[05:40 - 05:45]
avery and we seem to admit this belatedly to be
[05:45 - 05:50]
sure in assigning growing numbers of scholars to study and
[05:50 - 05:53]
teach the languages the cultures the histories and the values of the society.
[05:53 - 06:01]
This is all to the good. Ignorance no matter in what degree should become it.
[06:01 - 06:06]
But I feel that we ourselves are failing signally and we want to do
[06:06 - 06:11]
so as long as we only learn the other man's culture in order to
[06:11 - 06:16]
know how to cope with it in order to solve our own magnetic
[06:16 - 06:20]
problems. Our chief trouble is that our own
[06:20 - 06:25]
ignorance of the true nature of our own motors our society our
[06:25 - 06:30]
own mores our own social and spiritual values blinds us to a
[06:30 - 06:35]
real and successful effort to understand others we think ourselves
[06:35 - 06:39]
democratic and we are not a democratic nation.
[06:39 - 06:45]
We think ourselves generous and we are not a generous nation. We
[06:45 - 06:49]
are not a nation of generous people. How many people actually
[06:49 - 06:55]
exercise the old works of Korea vs which
[06:55 - 07:00]
consisted in helping the poor feeding the hungry comforting
[07:00 - 07:04]
the second visiting prisoners. How many of us would not rob.
[07:04 - 07:10]
Give our ten bucks to some automated charity and let some
[07:10 - 07:14]
kind of thieves in automation take care of our sense of obligation for
[07:14 - 07:18]
others rather than have a queasy feeling of helping
[07:18 - 07:21]
somebody personally.
[07:21 - 07:26]
It is this automation of our sentiments that has made us without
[07:26 - 07:31]
our knowledge almost incapable of communicating successfully
[07:31 - 07:35]
with Asians and of obtaining that cooperation.
[07:35 - 07:41]
What must we do. First we must place our actions on a rather more
[07:41 - 07:46]
selfless basis. And lightened self interest. A
[07:46 - 07:50]
term that has come into use in order to obtain support from both the pro
[07:50 - 07:54]
Me and energy aid sections of the electorate
[07:54 - 08:00]
is a cynical motive. People school in the traditions of midtown
[08:00 - 08:05]
or lovingkindness will not delay in coming to the heart of the matter in a very short
[08:05 - 08:10]
time and seeing it is a good deal more self interest than there
[08:10 - 08:15]
is and Lightman and such a policy. If they make
[08:15 - 08:19]
cynical uses of our aid and our military and other assistance
[08:19 - 08:24]
it will be who's to be outraged. Secondly
[08:24 - 08:29]
we must and this is indispensable. Take a
[08:29 - 08:34]
much more penetrating look at ourselves. I am not a fraud Ian
[08:34 - 08:39]
and I'm not suggesting a mass analysis of our culture. But a good bit of
[08:39 - 08:44]
intrusive introspection is I believe in order only in
[08:44 - 08:49]
the light of what we find out about ourselves. Will the easiest
[08:49 - 08:54]
cultures and the knowledge of them make much sense. Let's take the issue of
[08:54 - 08:57]
corruption. If we break a loudly
[08:57 - 09:04]
against corruption in Vietnam we insist to be offenders be
[09:04 - 09:08]
punished stripped of honors despoiled of their possessions exiled
[09:08 - 09:14]
or in prison. Their goodness neighbors must
[09:14 - 09:18]
be taken away from her. Now the crime a more often than not come from some
[09:18 - 09:23]
congressman who has several relatives on the payroll. But the fact is not
[09:23 - 09:28]
made easier to accept when you realize that there is a formal
[09:28 - 09:33]
injunction on people in the Confucian ethic such as
[09:33 - 09:37]
exists in Vietnam to the effect that they are under the deepest
[09:37 - 09:43]
obligation to help out the members of their families who need help.
[09:43 - 09:48]
The Vietnamese official therefore who hires dozens of nephews to work for
[09:48 - 09:53]
him at least has the advantage of being obliged to do this by a religious system.
[09:53 - 09:56]
And I think this is more than the hypothetical American congressman could claim.
[09:56 - 10:03]
Now the greater the Vietnamese officials power the deeper his obligation to an ever
[10:03 - 10:08]
larger number of relatives and followers. Now this is an important
[10:08 - 10:13]
ethical mandate and yet not now. Who is really corrupt.
[10:13 - 10:19]
I think self reliance. So nobody is deemed as to be
[10:19 - 10:24]
codified in a in an essay by Emerson separate lines of the great
[10:24 - 10:29]
American Virtue It's the embodiment of courage of independence of
[10:29 - 10:31]
human worth.
[10:31 - 10:36]
Then we are always slightly puzzled right. The Vietnamese fight.
[10:36 - 10:40]
Well I want the Indonesians fight all the time so the Filipinos are the Chinese
[10:40 - 10:41]
right.
[10:41 - 10:46]
Aren't they more independent. Why don't they do something and
[10:46 - 10:50]
only when they do do we become a bit mollified. Do we begin
[10:50 - 10:55]
here in a grumbling way to accept them. Now we
[10:55 - 11:00]
know in Vietnam that the Viet Cong from 1956 on
[11:00 - 11:06]
murder the patriarchal headed men of the villages in South Vietnam.
[11:06 - 11:11]
They knew what they were doing. By removing the symbol of authority
[11:11 - 11:16]
the Vietcong were also removing the motivation of the villagers to do one
[11:16 - 11:22]
thing rather than another to fight to resist or to go away.
[11:22 - 11:26]
The fact is that the villager in Vietnam does not make up his own
[11:26 - 11:31]
mind and decide things for himself. He does not in a word
[11:31 - 11:35]
praise or prize self reliance.
[11:35 - 11:40]
Councils of elders headed by the head man who is the man most deeply respected in the
[11:40 - 11:45]
pillars are deliberate on all matters affecting the common God
[11:45 - 11:50]
of all the villagers and always in the light of this greater good. They
[11:50 - 11:55]
decide what is justice in an individual case for an individual
[11:55 - 11:59]
petitioner. Now centuries of commune of living of this
[11:59 - 12:04]
sort does not make for much spontaneity of
[12:04 - 12:08]
judgment decision or resolution or
[12:08 - 12:14]
for self reliance. What the American tends to overlook
[12:14 - 12:19]
in that is that his tradition of self-reliance is not necessarily a universally
[12:19 - 12:24]
praiseworthy thing in a communist society. It is quite on the
[12:24 - 12:29]
other hand a deadly price. The American is
[12:29 - 12:33]
descended from dissidents and these broke away from one society to
[12:33 - 12:38]
make a new one over and again. Americans dissented even when the
[12:38 - 12:43]
dissenters. They broke off splinters struck out to new lands
[12:43 - 12:48]
new regions and they marched off with a yoke of oxen a Conestoga wagon
[12:48 - 12:54]
a suitcase full of merchandise a pick axe and a sense of liberty.
[12:54 - 13:00]
He had a whole continent. He didn't want to spoil the point.
[13:00 - 13:06]
Ledbetter no harmony with the goal of his thoughts and actions.
[13:06 - 13:11]
The people of Vietnam the people of Bali cannot be expected to
[13:11 - 13:14]
act this way in the first place. There is no way to govern
[13:14 - 13:20]
so that no departure can really liberate but the
[13:20 - 13:25]
contrary. The fact that there are no beams in Bali springs from the attachment of the
[13:25 - 13:30]
Balinese to his family and his private temple and attachment so
[13:30 - 13:35]
many that exile on a neighboring island only 10 miles
[13:35 - 13:39]
away is a matter for the most horrendous nightmares.
[13:39 - 13:45]
That is punishable precisely by this type of accident with the
[13:45 - 13:50]
result that one leaves money jewels and watches in a Balinese hotel room
[13:50 - 13:55]
with never a thought to their safety. You can always be sure they'll be there when you come back
[13:55 - 14:00]
from the beach. Now people are brought up in this tradition will simply
[14:00 - 14:05]
not find self-reliance useful. Quite the contrary it will too
[14:05 - 14:09]
often bring social reprisals of the most radical sort.
[14:09 - 14:14]
Therefore how can we expect a Vietnamese
[14:14 - 14:19]
peasant himself to take up a rifle and shoot somebody who's encroaching on his
[14:19 - 14:24]
political territory. It's folly to expect this and it's folly for us to judge the
[14:24 - 14:28]
Vietnamese peasant as an inferior pieces because of it. The fact
[14:28 - 14:33]
is we are being per blind now in
[14:33 - 14:38]
general. How do you explain the attitudes of this Vietnamese this
[14:38 - 14:39]
Chinese peasant.
[14:39 - 14:45]
The president in China certainly and yet no
[14:45 - 14:50]
in-ear of heaven. The gods
[14:50 - 14:56]
through signs which the peasant can recognize will indicate which side in
[14:56 - 15:01]
any dispute they favor and the pedant must side with the
[15:01 - 15:06]
faction so visibly and evidently smiled upon by fate.
[15:06 - 15:11]
If the French army is triumphant in Vietnam the Vietnamese peasant will
[15:11 - 15:16]
walk with the French colonial soldier from flowers his women
[15:16 - 15:20]
delighted to ally himself with them will the heavens bless.
[15:20 - 15:26]
After Gianni and to the peasant will see that Hanoi and which the
[15:26 - 15:30]
men have become the elector in the Boston sense of the weather
[15:30 - 15:35]
and their simple loyalty to their gods. Not necessarily the votes the men will
[15:35 - 15:40]
take take that thing now on or the group like yesterday were the enemy.
[15:40 - 15:45]
The signs of the gods are strange but they must be observed.
[15:45 - 15:52]
Now when I was growing up in a small New England town the bank if this
[15:52 - 15:56]
is possible was at least as holy a place as the church
[15:56 - 16:02]
the pastor though honored himself to the stodgy old
[16:02 - 16:06]
gentleman who owned the bank and quite a few textile factories besides
[16:06 - 16:13]
and probably good chunks of that then very good stock of the New Haven railroad.
[16:13 - 16:18]
There was the mystique of money in New England in those days. If you had it it
[16:18 - 16:23]
was as a result of your good. Conversely if you were very generous
[16:23 - 16:28]
you would get money. You would become rich and honored automatically. This
[16:28 - 16:32]
was not necessarily the result of self-reliance
[16:32 - 16:38]
because undermining everything was the concept that a Calvinistic God
[16:38 - 16:43]
had predetermined your salvation anyway and that your riches your virtue
[16:43 - 16:48]
and your self reliance on interchangeable were merely the signs
[16:48 - 16:54]
God given of this fact. The memory of his outlook is
[16:54 - 16:58]
not so distant as to make him comprehensible in the north east of the United States or
[16:58 - 17:03]
967 the ear of heaven approach of the Asian as
[17:03 - 17:09]
yet we scoff at it. Grumble growl and complain about high
[17:09 - 17:15]
taxes. Now what do all these observations lead to.
[17:15 - 17:19]
First of all to the need for us to be able to communicate with Asians successfully
[17:19 - 17:24]
we are not doing it now. We don't know how to. We use
[17:24 - 17:29]
dollars as the French use butter and the Italians tomatoes simply
[17:29 - 17:35]
because that's where we have the most up. We think of signs as a good attribute.
[17:35 - 17:40]
The bigger the better. When in fact she has size at the
[17:40 - 17:44]
sheer size of the American presence in Thailand today makes Don Juan
[17:44 - 17:49]
airport in Bangkok look like a large airfield in Texas with a small
[17:49 - 17:54]
delegation a visiting times. We cannot throw our signs around
[17:54 - 17:59]
and express expect mere verbal protestations of friendship to carry very
[17:59 - 18:03]
much weight and eloquence Soothing words are very
[18:03 - 18:08]
consoling to be at underfoot. Secondly we
[18:08 - 18:13]
must be able to obtain cooperation from nations important and lasting
[18:13 - 18:19]
cooperation. There are a great many of them and relatively few of us.
[18:19 - 18:24]
They are gifted intelligent honorable and dignified people with
[18:24 - 18:29]
refinements. Even among the humblest of them that we would sometimes be hard fought
[18:29 - 18:33]
hard to find even on Park Avenue.
[18:33 - 18:38]
But this we cannot do if we do not know why we are seeking their cooperation
[18:38 - 18:42]
offering ours nothing so baffling as American
[18:42 - 18:47]
aid has ever hit. Why do the Americans
[18:47 - 18:51]
do it. In truth even the Americans don't know
[18:51 - 18:56]
so we cannot expect many Asians to have a clear grasp of our intentions
[18:56 - 19:00]
especially those most difficult to perceive the good ones
[19:00 - 19:06]
in a world which is today not much larger than a golf ball.
[19:06 - 19:11]
We had better start learning to share a good many things to learn. A good many
[19:11 - 19:15]
things and to face a few unpleasant truths about ourselves.
[19:15 - 19:22]
If we don't the cooperation without which human beings may no longer be able to exist
[19:22 - 19:27]
will be forever forgotten. We have an opportunity with our
[19:27 - 19:31]
mystique of the equality of men if not with our practice
[19:31 - 19:37]
and with our traditions of thoughtful philanthropy if not with our love of neighbor
[19:37 - 19:43]
to help the world prepare to live in some sort of harmony. The quarters are
[19:43 - 19:47]
getting closer. We have the means to make a substantial
[19:47 - 19:52]
contribution to mankind. But first we must put ourselves into a
[19:52 - 19:57]
condition to bring this about. We must learn to appreciate the hundreds of
[19:57 - 20:02]
millions of Asians their culture and their great arts and their noble heritage. But
[20:02 - 20:06]
we must do even more earnestly take a look at ourselves.
[20:06 - 20:10]
Do we really believe in the equality of men in helping others.
[20:10 - 20:16]
I we really mean some seeking honest self-seeking might be
[20:16 - 20:22]
tolerable enough but our enemies may not even be that high.
[20:22 - 20:27]
In order to preserve a smug and self-satisfied social order we are trying
[20:27 - 20:32]
to make the world over in our own image and the good Brahmans of Boston did the Irish.
[20:32 - 20:37]
Then we are practicing up our charity and leading to our own subtle removal from the
[20:37 - 20:42]
center of the world of our world. The cabinets and the
[20:42 - 20:46]
models. We must remember who have been displaced by Kennedys
[20:46 - 20:53]
that they don't have learned from South Boston America and still learn from
[20:53 - 20:58]
major harmony of social orders could still be achieved.
[20:58 - 21:02]
But the physician must heal himself.
[21:02 - 21:05]
Thank you for the
[21:05 - 21:14]
aa.
[21:14 - 21:25]
Arise.
[21:25 - 21:31]
You heard Lionel Landry director of the Asia Society as he spoke on the topic.
[21:31 - 21:35]
Most of mankind. This was another programme in the
[21:35 - 21:41]
series. Peace love and creativity the hope of mankind.
[21:41 - 21:46]
The speaker on our next program will be Saul K. pad over chairman of the Department of
[21:46 - 21:50]
Political and social science at the New School for Social Research. Mr.
[21:50 - 21:55]
Pett over subject will be the causes of war. These
[21:55 - 22:00]
programs originate at the Cooper Union in New York City and are recorded by station
[22:00 - 22:05]
WNYC. The programs are made available to this station by the
[22:05 - 22:07]
national educational radio network.
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