Daniel J. Boorstin discussion, part one

Man and the multitude. This University of Illinois

Centennial symposium presented by the College of Liberal Arts and Sciences studies

contemporary man poised between past and future. And between

isolation and community of the world. Guest speakers and panel

members comment on the conflicting forces which push men apart from others and

into communion with others. Lectures in this series will be followed by

discussions involving speakers visiting professors and University of Illinois

faculty members as well as interested students. On our last

program Daniel J Boston professor of American history at the University of Chicago

discussed the culture of communications. He explained the three types of

communities the one a vision and mission the one of function and

collaboration and the modern community obvious because dismantling.

The development of norms or group standards has tied together members of the modern community.

Information about these norms has been prompted by the use of statistics ready made

clothing proper financial records income tax intelligence tests

opinion polls life insurance and immigrants. Through

these factors people have become aware of inclusion or exclusion from

groups. Mr. Bush then will answer questions by Dr Rieders

Simon associate professor of sociology and research associate in the Institute of

communications research at the University of Illinois Dr. James W. Kerry

assistant professor of journalism and research assistant professor in the Institute of communications

research. And Fred S. seabird dean of communications arts

Michigan State University. Dr. H Egon a professor of speech and

head of the Division of General Studies at the University of Illinois well act as chairman for the

discussion.

One of the members of the student panel will open the discussion I think that

the papers for example that their reader will not remember what

he read the day before and not remember what he read the day after that

that they live continually in the present.

The Hollywood westerns that distort the history and present us with a

very very conceptualized the mutiny of the old left

innocent distorts our path to cut us off from the reality of it

also literally that advertising that tells us that we can to and in

meeting the president. Just by buying a new suit of clothes or buy

them by buying a Mustang and acquiring the girl and all the things that go with

that. We can't deny our past if you

think this is the plight of the American dream that the media has encouraged

this sort of Horatio Alger dream because no matter what our past that we can conquer it we can

overcome it.

Another call in here before we connected was to burst and

I was thinking that an individual who

sits and watches television for any great length of time will periodic leak through the through

the through the and it was that he received that well even even other forms of media will receive

a lot of what you call data. I'm left thinking objectivity is

a you know as much a fact of life as a girl will be sought after and something that would seem to be

at least according to the viewpoint of the individual that every

interest group that there's the program to serve as we say if

there were little office behind this would support a liberal argument and a general rise

especially around election time you can see all kinds of things like this and

I've been in when the average have been proud of just a lot of death and the cigarettes gamble you

saw that's where there were people. The cigarette people who

were looking to the interests of the cigarette manufacturers were were

pulling all of the all of the information. If if they call again information that was

produced as to the relationship of cigarette smoking to cancer and on the other hand the other

interests are supposedly in the public safety that their argument where

we're presenting information and the like to believe that it was really valid that there was a strong

connection and so individual who used to seem that continually

and then I'm going to make sure he doesn't get any he doesn't get I think

normative structure in the sense that you could do to grab a ball

that he sees nothing but a crumpled thing right morass of opinions expressed and

expressed and I relive that.

I was thinking about a certain craft He's working here are playing better atomization

or the person being plugged into this technology. Individually his.

Record Player tapes that are being probably hired to

record music in the car's power they can make getting a

secondary sort of experience right. You know right if people stand back from the

event rivals the point two people stand around watch this group kill.

Rats like rushing it on TV we don't really feel any I mean it's not like Nicole this is

not an extension of ourselves really because we watch it and we somehow feel

disassociated from and I do think that we are becoming animals that running

across this is something like The Beatles for a

for that never changes. Yeah there's a tendency in

France to bring people together. If you've ever watched right now chances

are some of the big questions where you have a lot of dancing

to individuals around the floor around look absolutely ludicrous

when they hear they stary.

Doing skate or something like that you are looking

for people that are certain you know or that develops a kind of community action

that they look good when there are people

doing another Tennessee it's like these in California where

everything that moves so fast because of the absolute enormousness you get

I can see like in these apartments you know are you people of a certain like Norm conscious

people there's a good team and very good very good team going Scott

and they are getting their partners and then they go in with the idea let's all be friendly let's have a community

are the same things like the Haight Ashbury. Yeah they have a sense of

community and maybe it's a revolt against those atoms that do think there are certain

ways or maybe to different levels and whenever we can more

specialized or more normal concerts for particular groups within that group I think there are certain

groups forming it.

You're going to think that

I was thinking the first time I ever think I want in my life.

I mean it's been over a

long period or.

When you are writing you ravers in

music and

romantic music and what we have some way

of the random generator from the well

made of something which

you know by the governor out of a lot of Rahm

Emanuel and the Republicans here because it would make think something about that

which. Back to back to Britain. The

fact that more data coming in from technology already in

some larger way. And what happened in

a lot more data coming in the world becoming much more rich

in what available. I want an awful lot of information coming in over the

data coming in and it's not rhetoric. One can

leverage where no one anywhere in the world are making me think very

you know for whatever limited amount of information available whether they happen information coming in that is

totally I'm going to never reputation there's nothing you can do with it. Nobody had any

experience with with the rep coming in every can't get

anybody very very and to tell you that you're never really going to

lean upon them

very happy.

Can we get you to respond.

Well I mean if it was not my

intention to use technology as an explanation as the explanation I was

just suggesting that was a one direction in which we might look. There are some

other questions that arise out of the interesting comments that have been made.

One of the things that's puzzled me considering that so much

of our technology has been directed to controlling climatic conditions into

our climatic condition along with ready made clothing of course

central heating refrigeration and air conditioning have

been characteristic American institutions

have been astonished to discover the great emphasis

which is better.

The number of times that the temperature air and the weather prediction

was given it was a Saturday

which does not consist primarily of farmers and an effect on

crops. Doesn't some very severe weather

doesn't even affect our transportation. Basically what the

temperature is and what is likely to be and whether it's been the center and

so on. This repetition Also I am

a listener and a watcher of the media is a little off the radio

and impressed by the repetitious as you say there wasn't much repetition but

the similarity of the broadcasts.

Hour and a half hour. Sometimes it's 25 minutes past and five minutes to

something astonishing that if you listen for longer than

two minutes the proper moment.

Same thing over again. And some catastrophe

on television. Well aware that expensive

broadcasting

programs time to the second big

expensive taste

of the function of editing stretching and

cutting. You have to make it.

Happen to coincide every four minutes and seconds or whatever

certain broadcast.

Filling the receptacle takes precedence over all other

considerations and becomes more and more true

then of course what the filling of the filling is there to provide us the sensations that are

supposed to come of black and white impressions on the paper or of

images on the television screen or whatever but I think Parkinson's

Law which you're all acquainted with is only one example of that.

Never ministers or any institution

because the more administrators the administration there has to be more

more interoffice.

And some of faxing and other duplicating machine cannot be explained

by the need for it. They can only explain it was a

question a suggestion was made as it was puzzled that I was suggesting that there was

an autonomous nature to this process I think it is autonomous like you have the

economy going. You can't stop it and you have large industries

like Xerox and others. IBM and so on they spend their

time inventing as much as anything else.

Television is a very good example. Was there a demand for

television were developed and perfected and the development then created the

demand. How much demand was there for Electric for example

electric toothbrushes 15 years ago when there wasn't any but

the economy developed certain

there were developments in the economy which provided the

people who were producing them then had to create the demand in order to dispose of commodity.

Another aspect of this which is which I think has not had sufficient attention

is something which I discovered to my astonishment was

actually an invention an institutional invention and that is

the model.

And have you read the autobiography of Alfred P. Sloan

recommended to drink as an interesting fascinating

and unfortunately it's not very readable. It's one

reason why it hasn't been widely read but it's full of interesting intimate and long General

Motors and more than anybody else who

has a way of applying the principle to the whole economy.

That showed that it would sell more automobiles

by having variations in the types of every year

and he simply developed and applied this principle. He also

developed another principle which was related which was I suppose what we

would call the ladder of consumption became

head of General Motors I had an agglomeration of automobiles and the

cheapest Buick was less expensive than the most and most expensive

Chevrolet and so on that he decided to

take kind of a ladder of consumption so people could climb up this ladder moving upward from

each other and so on and so on. And he did this by separating the

class the price ranges and then he also the other one thing

about the model oddly enough and this is one of the most amazing parts of the story.

He's a very smart man. But one of the things which was overlooked was if you

persuaded people to buy a new automobile every year.

That the people

dispose of the automobiles while they were still usable. And this was the fly

in the flying landscape.

But this is just another example of the way in which to keep

them going there's a momentum

that creates all kinds of problems.

Just mention one other item and because it's

been a general assumption I think and I think justified

to the problem of conformity and uniformity in American life

is to encourage more and more minorities and minorities in

our in the arts and in politics and

all sorts of other that this will be a way to encourage people to be

themselves small. As you know

common accusations talk that at least I'm still

against this country. This is a country of the tyranny of the majority

and a synonym for conformity. And this is one of the

commonest and most enthusiastically made complaints by

intellectuals all over the world against the United States as a nation conformist.

If you live in a state and you discover that it is just about the only

thing on which Americans are able to agree. Name the conformists.

But when you come down to the specific conformity there are many problems. I

would suggest that the multiplication groups the groups

which conform to norms which is.

Contemporaneous with the rise of minorities in the multiplication of

minority groups that have the

problem of the pressure of conformity.

I would suggest rather that the pressure of conformity tends to be

the size of the group the

larger the group.

An American man one that involves certain make certain

implications about what they expect to do them to a certain expectation

but those expectations are much vaguer and larger and less clearly

defined than the expectations of an American. But if I get down to

a category as I was also a professor and a professor of history and so on the pressure of

conformity increases with the smallness of the group

and the multiplication of smaller groups.

The problem of conformity

to the problem of conformity and one of the odd things certain groups

the groups which which live on protest Hells Angels and

motorcycling groups and others which can come back full circle and can only express

their form and express their

individuality because all of the resources.

I think this is a this is a problem and it's conceivable

that if we are in quest of a way

of discovering what each of us really affectively

we have what used to be called the tyranny of the majority. That is if

we have but forcible

conformity rather than a more rigid and

enforceable conformity smaller groups.

I wonder what does it turn now to Professor Simon.

Not necessarily change the subject but see if she wants to

go on with this or introduce some other kinds of ideas that will come back to this

individual experience.

I'm not sure of the comment that I'm going to arrange to

go directly to the point you're talking about but I think perhaps they do.

The first comment I suppose is more of a question and the problem. Unless

I misunderstood you right you are suggesting what you were saying last night

was that the mass communications

and mass communications particularly to

fragment was to exaggerate differences within the society

and I had always thought and I think that's

probably one of the major pumpkins of the mass media or mass communication is

to bring about a kind of various groups and this is

to serve to emphasize similarities and in the sense of

oneness and in fact historically there was a great deal of emphasis

on difference. The New Englander versus seven

families versus the emphasis on quantification

in the society rather than pointing to differences among us have

served to kind of homogenous. Like if

I'm wrong I'd like you to talk to that. But then I want to make one other point which again I

think is in the form of the question.

And when it comes to your concept of community of norms

or the concept of the consuming community I'm

somewhat I don't understand a concept that is because

I doubt that when people who buy the same products or

who are the same hero or celebrity or someone

think of themselves as being a community that is I

buy time detergent for my thing but it never occurs to me to think

that all the people who buy the same kind of nature

in our community of which are members

so I think that the concept of a community of

norms. We have people who share

certain identities

system. I don't

think any evidence would suggest that because people purchase the same product.

Thank you thank you.

Well first of all the first

question of whether the multiplication of media emphasizes similarities or

differences. The first question now I think that in the first

place this will be perhaps the most

accurate way of putting it. The media emphasize

there is no deceiving. Now I think it

is also likely that the

similarities and differences.

People with people are aware probably of being Americans than they

were before there were the media and there are also being members of certain separate

groups.

I was suggesting

and developing the notion.

One country that was not that I was

not meaning to suggest that the media do not draw people together in the

media are entirely divisive.

But I was suggesting a kind of function which is

performed by the media which have been very difficult to have been

performed by any agency before because the concepts were not there.

I don't think the century that you would have a

businessman I don't think that you would you would have written for

example thinking of himself we have had his autobiography and text

you know that or that he thought of them as a business

executive Just for example.

I'm suggesting then is that the convergence of not just in the

presence of the media then the media with an opportunity to

ask

the question the

question isn't for them to go into and I'm not sure that we

can measure that anyway. It's not necessary for my purposes

to deny that the people together.

To them this is the same evidence of the

separateness which is not possible because of the creation of these

categories which had not even of the people earlier

times and which are the primary

for different kinds

of classes of different kinds of

groups to which I can be a member.

That would have been the case in 89.

Probably wouldn't conceivably have thought of myself as a second generation immigrant.

Just for example

which sort of

depends on the group as intensity of feeling.

Very good example of this is religion

statistics of

the

study which I would think for example of what you

can do which is an excellent source

that can understand it would have been inconceivable. The question would have been whether a person

was an adherent of a religion

a belief to his environment or his neighborhood or something

that's in the

business I think would have been.